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  • #23,661
  • Oct 6, 2023 2:22am Oct 6, 2023 2:22am
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} Because as soon as the trail stops (usually at the initial balance) you are trading 100% own money (your accumulated profits). However you are not getting 100% of the profits. There's a way of beating trailing stop firms but one has to game the system instead of just trading. It's to make big trades and big wins and cash them immediately, causing the account to violate. Props won't allow us to do this many times.
I'd take a trailing DD if it was bigger than a fixed drawdown. These FX props don't offer that so it's just another ploy.

I believed Funded Trading Plus when they explained how your trailing became static and then you used that equity as a buffer which was making the "live" model viable from a risk perspective, it made sense to me from a commercial view. However in light of the MFF incident the curtains have fallen and the wizard hiding behind it is just pure bullshit.

Why should you have a trailing stop and an equity buffer when there is NO live risk to the prop?

IF IT'S SIMULATED - IT'S A CON?
  • #23,662
  • Oct 6, 2023 3:10am Oct 6, 2023 3:10am
stop acting like b book is something new and you didnt know about it. Christ all mighty.
  • #23,663
  • Oct 6, 2023 3:14am Oct 6, 2023 3:14am
Did anyone try Axi Select? Looks like it is a new player on the market
  • #23,664
  • Oct 6, 2023 3:19am Oct 6, 2023 3:19am
Quoting Mertens
Did anyone try Axi Select? Looks like it is a new player on the market
Search this topic. Plenty of discussion some weeks ago about it.
  • #23,665
  • Oct 6, 2023 3:27am Oct 6, 2023 3:27am
Quoting Takisd
stop acting like b book is something new and you didnt know about it. Christ all mighty.
So is this even B book? Demo trades go to any book do they?
  • #23,666
  • Oct 6, 2023 3:40am Oct 6, 2023 3:40am
Hi everyone, for those looking for UAE based prop firms options, here’s one I am currently checking: https://fundingtraders.com

Their conditions are attractive and so far the only issue was IT weaknesses on challenge payment processing.
But again some usual warning signs with substantial discount and possibility to go up to 100% payout ratio by purchasing add-on at 30% of net challenge cost after bonus.

All the best.
I used to be indecisive but now I'm not so sure...
  • #23,667
  • Oct 6, 2023 3:46am Oct 6, 2023 3:46am
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} Search this topic. Plenty of discussion some weeks ago about it.
Do you mean in this thread or it was a separate topic?
  • #23,668
  • Oct 6, 2023 4:00am Oct 6, 2023 4:00am
Quoting Mertens
Did anyone try Axi Select? Looks like it is a new player on the market
https://www.forexfactory.com/thread/...-hub?page=1082

There was several pages of discussion around this page. Go back and forward
  • #23,669
  • Oct 6, 2023 4:07am Oct 6, 2023 4:07am
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} Because as soon as the trail stops (usually at the initial balance) you are trading 100% own money (your accumulated profits). However you are not getting 100% of the profits. There's a way of beating trailing stop firms but one has to game the system instead of just trading. It's to make big trades and big wins and cash them immediately, causing the account to violate. Props won't allow us to do this many times.
I feel like Im on deep waters here that its beyond my knowledge hearing that. But same time one thinks like that one just need to create a cushion with the profits. Since you still get the same initial power of capital and to move around freely with even after you hit the Trailing DD cap. So if you are a consistent trader I dont understand how that can be disadvantage to you. Just hit that cap, trade consistent as before and create small cushion and good to go.

If one is unable to create or uncertain to get a decent cushion maybe few weeks worth of profits. Then I can understand why your method is necessary. But isnt that purely based on personal tactics if so rather than the best working method.

So even if its 90% profit split "common sense to me" the advantages of trailing drawdown cap would be massive compared to DD in forex prop firms if the futures prop firms doesnt have a DD that is which some of them removed now. Its as if theres some non logical bias against futures prop firms using trailing drawdown. Since its not as easy to use hit and run methods maybe as it was with forex prop firms. Thus the bias becomes angled. I could be wrong but what it appears to me.

Edit: I also realized Futures prop firms cater to intraday traders. Which isnt exactly the norm among forex prop firm traders. Which could explain the bias.
  • #23,670
  • Oct 6, 2023 4:18am Oct 6, 2023 4:18am
Quoting labu
{quote} I feel like Im on deep waters here that its beyond my knowledge hearing that. But same time one thinks like that one just need to create a cushion with the profits. Since you still get the same initial power of capital and to move around freely with even after you hit the Trailing DD cap. So if you are a consistent trader I dont understand how that can be disadvantage to you. Just hit that cap, trade consistent as before and create small cushion and good to go. If one is unable to create or uncertain to get a decent cushion maybe few weeks...
It's simple math.

If I start with 100K with 10% static DD and I get to 105K I can withdraw 5K and I still have 10% DD to accommodate for bad trades.
If I start with 100K with 10% trailing DD and I get to 105K I can withdraw 5K but now I only have 5% DD to accommodate for bad trades.

It's pretty evident how this is a disadvantage

Now make it 10K and you see how is even worse for profitable traders:
I start with 100K and 10% static DD. I make 10K and I can withdraw 10K. Still have 10% DD.
I start with 100K and 10% trailing DD. I make 10K and if I withdraw 10K my account is closed.
  • #23,671
  • Edited 5:11am Oct 6, 2023 4:36am | Edited 5:11am
Bespoke just made the first 6-figure payout of $120k to a trader. Proof of payment is on Discord.
  • #23,672
  • Oct 6, 2023 4:37am Oct 6, 2023 4:37am
Quoting Fagin
{quote} So is this even B book? Demo trades go to any book do they?
Where would b-book trades go otherwise? To the unicorn in the sky? They go straight into the rusty bucket, same as demo trades or "sim" trades. B book is just a name for an order disappearing act.
  • #23,673
  • Oct 6, 2023 4:45am Oct 6, 2023 4:45am
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} It's simple math. If I start with 100K with 10% static DD and I get to 105K I can withdraw 5K and I still have 10% DD to accommodate for bad trades. If I start with 100K with 10% trailing DD and I get to 105K I can withdraw 5K but now I only have 5% DD to accommodate for bad trades. It's pretty evident how this is a disadvantage Now make it 10K and you see how is even worse for profitable traders: I start with 100K and 10% static DD. I make 10K and I can withdraw 10K. Still have 10% DD. I start with 100K and 10% trailing DD. I make 10K and...
Ok I agree that makes sense on those futures prop firms with normal DD but quite a few removed it right.
Normal DD models forex prop firms: 10k have same DD each day no matter what. Reach 12k 5% DD still everyday.
Futures prop firms with only trailing drawdown cap: Reach that 12k. You suddenly got about 13% DD if cap is at 10500. Since the DD becomes dynamic.

But even futures prop firms with DD would act same as forex prop firms if one is able to build that cushion right just $500 is needed apart from the trailing drawdown so sure. Bit more bothersome than normal forex prop firms if they still have DD. But even so, due to the nature of these futures prop firms always been more reliable to payout, doesnt that make futures prop firms score way higher especially as MFF faded away. Only MFF made it more sensible to trade with forex prop firms since easy to register, no data feeds to pay etc and reliable payout, apart from FTMO.

Not even Apex funding got DD now just a cap. But personally wouldnt recommend them due to how they change withdrawal rules to left and right.
  • #23,674
  • Oct 6, 2023 4:52am Oct 6, 2023 4:52am
Quoting TrAndy1
Bespoke just made the first 6-figure payout of $120k to a trader.
Did that trader give proof of it, or do we believe in santa claus now. How would we even know it wasnt their own guy they paid too. Considering most thought and trusted MFF was not like the others . Even if internal document leaks showed they used same methods as others . So if not even one of the most trustworthy forex prop firms was decent behind the scenes why would you trust some kids. Makes no sense to me Oh right you got paid by them right once or so. THen they ditched you.
  • #23,675
  • Oct 6, 2023 5:45am Oct 6, 2023 5:45am
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} It's simple math. If I start with 100K with 10% static DD and I get to 105K I can withdraw 5K and I still have 10% DD to accommodate for bad trades. If I start with 100K with 10% trailing DD and I get to 105K I can withdraw 5K but now I only have 5% DD to accommodate for bad trades. It's pretty evident how this is a disadvantage Now make it 10K and you see how is even worse for profitable traders: I start with 100K and 10% static DD. I make 10K and I can withdraw 10K. Still have 10% DD. I start with 100K and 10% trailing DD. I make 10K and...
Originally I believe this discussion started with mentioning The Trading Pit VIP CFD program. Though it also uses a trailing DD it is not so disadvantageous.

It trails the high-water balance mark by 10% while you need to reach 8% profit to be eligible for the payout. You make 8%, then get your profit, and a new account with higher balance. The scale up is pretty rapid I would say - you basically double the balance every other step, ie. when you make 2 x 8%. Not bad! You start with 100K and the last step (10th) gives you $5M balance to trade.

So with every profitable trade you maintain the 10% DD rather then increasing it. For some (like me) this is actually good as I tend to risk more when I gain only to give it back. Knowing I always have the same DD makes me think twice about my trades and stay more consistent
Money is made by sitting, not trading
  • #23,676
  • Oct 6, 2023 8:03am Oct 6, 2023 8:03am
Any updates about the hearing, is it on 11th of October now or postponed again ?
  • #23,677
  • Oct 6, 2023 9:05am Oct 6, 2023 9:05am
Glow Node seems to have a subjective rule when analyzing trades, based on "high risk trading”

This is from Telegram:
-May I ask does Glow node allows passing the challenge with a few trades? Such as 1 or 2 trades?

CEO: We do yes but it also depends on the amount of risk you use and the times. As an example if you drop 30 lots on gold during a news event and pass, we may ask you to try again and show some risk management skills. If you however take a trade on Monday and hold that trade till Wednesday and pass then no problem at all!

- thanks alot for your reply.
My 100K phase 2 account has traded 12.95 lots of EURUSD, holded the short position for 10 hours, the trend was so strong, and I did past the challenge. My anohter two phase1 accounts also used similar strategy (ride the trend) and got upgraded.
And in my phase2 review stage, I revieved an email says my account is breached due to high risk trading..
For me this “high risk trading” behaviour isnt very clearly wrote in the webpage..and now I am worried about my another two newly upgraded phase2 accounts, should I continue to trade (with lower risk)? can they all get breached at review stage because the trades I palced at phase1?

CEO: They can all be breached if you’re using risky trading strategies. Send me a message privately with your ID and I’ll have a look into it.
  • #23,678
  • Oct 6, 2023 9:13am Oct 6, 2023 9:13am
Quoting TrAndy1
Any updates about the hearing, is it on 11th of October now or postponed again ?
postponed from receiver side.
  • #23,679
  • Oct 6, 2023 9:28am Oct 6, 2023 9:28am
Quoting Capablanca
Glow Node seems to have a subjective rule when analyzing trades, based on "high risk trading”
Glow Node has this in their rules (which says it all):

Quote
We don’t require you to use the same trading style and strategy all the time.
However you are required to trade in the same way you have in your challenge on the live account.
Money is made by sitting, not trading
  • #23,680
  • Oct 6, 2023 9:31am Oct 6, 2023 9:31am
"Glow Node" for real? I wondered if we we talking about something other than prop shops then...
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