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Attachments: Most volatile EU/GU/XAU/BTC trading
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Most volatile EU/GU/XAU/BTC trading

Quoting ryuryu
People ask me what kind of music I listen to when I trade. Like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcatFmFgerM and this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J6AvHJosquk Of course this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BSXqHtGgnc And this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8zH2JP4LgaE So for those who wants to dig into my brains it looks like this: 1. Drop it! 2. Are you ready your F mind? 3. Do you wanna really taste It? (And throw your dog and invisible bone) 4. Pretender (What if I say I will never surrender?)...
Hi Ryu,

  1. Sorry, I totally disliked the first two...
  2. The third one is ok, but very cheesy and plastic. For that kind of mood, I would choose something like Edguy instead.
  3. The fourth one is very good. I love most of Infected Mushroom.

Cheers!

Quoting ryuryu
Previous high/low trading logic. Few days ago Three Amigos was discussing interesting thing. And occasionally we found that we all are using previous high/low in our trading, but may be just in little different way. But the main idea is the same. {image} So first take you favorite instrument to measure the volume and the distance. Then choose a coin(s) to trade. I prefer maxim 3 at once. And now wait for sequence to be complete: {image} Cross found -> MA order good -> MA distance good - > ema6 low bounce back under ema30 -> new high found (in range...
Wow... but... they are... lines/past price levels ... I genuinely thought you considered them utterly useless!
So... with volume leading they way, of course... is it finally at least "ok" to use them as some sort of "confluence"?
I'm confused now...

Btw... I'm also curious about something else:
If BTC and ETH are the most liquid cryptos by a long run, always with tons of volume compared to everything else, why don't you scalp them more often?
Sorry if it's just an assumption, but most of your examples are with lesser ALTs. Is it because you still mainly look for Pump & Dump style imbalances, as I wrote some time ago in the enemy thread?
Quoting kk100
{quote} First. I started follow Ruys thread quite early, because I am spying what Rick is writing here , and has wroten earlier.like i do sometimes moodys. Ruy was little wild, but i saw there are interesting things how Ruy was trading bold, and I told Rick, it doesn't matter if know what Ruy is doing. There was some weak moments , when we all doubt our skills. If i remember i try to courage continue and not stop. I haven't see never so huge progress. I am very happy for Ruy and amigos. We need new ways do incomes, which reminds things, when I introduce...
KK, thanks for remembering me from time to time ^^
We should talk soon, about Science/Tech, Sci-Fi or anything interesting...
Quoting BWilliam
Hi everyone, Since I'm mentioned on this thread I make a response here. I don't take sides. I just express my opinion with whatever knowledge I have. Ofc I can be wrong. And I meant no offence to anyone. It's has been the case always. Nothing personal. I understand what ryuryu do, his method/strategy. Rick has written many times the explanation behind the strategy. This may come as a shock to some, but that's similar to how I do it years ago too. I wrote to Rick many times in the past, check my post history, why don't he extend this same strategy...
Hi Jason,

"I understand what ryuryu do, his method/strategy. Rick has written many times the explanation behind the strategy. This may come as a shock to some, but that's similar to how I do it years ago too. I wrote to Rick many times in the past, check my post history, why don't he extend this same strategy knowledge beyond this small M1 tf. Why scalp when if this same strategy is expanded will give the same type of trades but swing trades instead of scalps? Hence overcoming the cost issues that make this 1m tf scalps untradable on forex brokers."

You say that you understand Ryu & Rick's strategy/method, but this message clearly automatically proves that you don't (or not entirely); simply because it CAN'T be applied to bigger time-frames/time-horizons... it is only about trading IN THE NOW (ticks between seconds), along with the seesaw flow, riding the micro-waves in and out, short and quick.

No, it won't give the "same type of swing trades instead of scalps"; volume & liquidity do not work that way. And "costs" isn't what makes it untradeable on Forex brokers using CFDs; there are more factors, starting by real-time data measures and executions.

And I don't think that "swings are further extensions of scalps", because they don't work the same way, even if (but ONLY structurally) history price charts appear as "fractal"... Time-frames are just graphical measurements divided in chunks, but in reality they don't exist... only price across time does, and it changes when buy/bid & sell/ask are met with market orders (same as when limit orders and executed).

---

Regarding your "live calls", sorry, but I haven't seen any actionable call with clear pre-set timings and levels (order and direction). For example, someone who actually does (beforehand) and without such ambiguity, is the member "senjamerah", illustrating that just trading "price structure" (levels/lines/"targets") with "price action" (nothing else than price movement-development around those areas). Therefore, yes, I agree that lines/levels in a "naked chart", without volume, can be enough to trade profitable; at the expense of being less "mechanical" (hence not prone to proper automation), less consistent, more ambiguous and subjective/discretionary. Everything's relative, though.

So could you please elaborate and specify?

Regards,
Vik
Quoting Viktor
{quote} Wow... but... they are... lines/past price levels ... I genuinely thought you considered them utterly useless! So... with volume leading they way, of course... is it finally at least "ok" to use them as some sort of "confluence"? I'm confused now... Btw... I'm also curious about something else: If BTC and ETH are the most liquid cryptos by a long run, always with tons of volume compared to everything else, why don't you scalp them more often? Sorry if it's just an assumption, but most of your examples are with lesser ALTs. Is it because...
There are 2 important things: volume and distance range. On BTC and ETH the distance is always very small, because there are a lot of bots trading it and a lot of people too. So I trade em not often. Smaller the range = bigger the risk and lower the profits. As I remember this month I was trading BTC only once.

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For example check here: we have OP with good volume (>200 000$/min) and 0.71% distance, ETC with 0.87%
And BTC with 0.11%, ETH with 0.18%

What is the reason to earn 0.11% instead of 0.8%? It is 8x times less risky or 8x times more profitable.
So in this case I'd trade ETC and OP. A week ago it was SOL and GMT. I don't care how it called, I just check the volume and the distance.
Observer effect
As example. Today I have earned +10.69% with 4 trades.

It was +0.6948% with OP and +2.2131% with DOT.

And looks like APE will be ready to trade soon.

UPD: yes, +1.6602% APE

UPD: and +5.7944% APE
Observer effect
Time to post stats for July.

01/07/22 +10.27%
02/07/22 +9.71%
03/07/22 +0.18%
04/07/22 +1.44%
06/07/22 +10.97%
07/07/22 +11.37%
10/07/22 +1.94%
11/07/22 +0.77%
13/07/22 +26.28%
18/07/22 +12.61%
23/07/22 +34.13%
24/07/22 +1.73%
29/07/22 +3.55%
31/07/22 +10.69%
Observer effect
Quoting ryuryu
Time to post stats for July. 01/07/22 +10.27% 02/07/22 +9.71% 03/07/22 +0.18% 04/07/22 +1.44% 06/07/22 +10.97% 07/07/22 +11.37% 10/07/22 +1.94% 11/07/22 +0.77% 13/07/22 +26.28% 18/07/22 +12.61% 23/07/22 +34.13% 24/07/22 +1.73% 29/07/22 +3.55% 31/07/22 +10.69%
Quoting ryuryu
{quote} There are 2 important things: volume and distance range. On BTC and ETH the distance is always very small, because there are a lot of bots trading it and a lot of people too. So I trade em not often. Smaller the range = bigger the risk and lower the profits. As I remember this month I was trading BTC only once. {image} For example check here: we have OP with good volume (>200 000$/min) and 0.71% distance, ETC with 0.87% And BTC with 0.11%, ETH with 0.18% What is the reason to earn 0.11% instead of 0.8%? It is 8x times less risky or 8x times...
Ok, smart thing to do. So yes, still filtering for the best conditions/opportunities, as I thought.

Are your percentage increases shown here, on the account or per individual trade (used margin)?

Also curious, what's your avg and max DD (on the account) at any given time?

And what results do you think you could achieve only trading BTC and ETH 5 days per week for ~5 hours?

I hope you're ok with the questions. Just want to understand and have a better idea
Quoting Viktor
{quote} Ok, smart thing to do. So yes, still filtering for the best conditions/opportunities, as I thought. Are your percentage increases shown here, on the account or per individual trade (used margin)? Also curious, what's your avg and max DD (on the account) at any given time? And what results do you think you could achieve only trading BTC and ETH 5 days per week for ~5 hours? I hope you're ok with the questions. Just want to understand and have a better idea

Didn't get why you want to trade BTC and ETH and 5 days a week. You have to trade when the market is allow to trade and that coin that market allow you.
This week there were no opportunity to trade BTC and ETH. This week was a week of OP and ETC. Previous 3 weeks was SOL trading. And so on.
I already said that trading BTC make no sense. It is like trading EURUSD and XAUUSD - 5-8x times more risky and less profitable.

Regarding to the income. For example you start your day with 10000$ equity. And end it with 12300$ equity with equal amount of balance. That mean you earned 23%.

Regarding DD it is very big story. It is calculated depending on many factors: equity, balance, amount of assets in trade, previous profits, average profits and many many factors. For example today, the last day on the month, I can have DD about 80%, because I have already earned more than 100%. I'll make a post about money management some day.

Observer effect
Quoting ryuryu
{quote} Didn't get why you want to trade BTC and ETH and 5 days a week. You have to trade when the market is allow to trade and that coin that market allow you. This week there were no opportunity to trade BTC and ETH. This week was a week of OP and ETC. Previous 3 weeks was SOL trading. And so on. I already said that trading BTC make no sense. It is like trading EURUSD and XAUUSD - 5-8x times more risky and less profitable. Regarding to the income. For example you start your day with 10000$ equity. And end it with 12300$ equity with equal amount...
I understand the reason. I question it as an hypothetical, to have a better frame of reference for comparison to other markets, like FX and Index Futures, where the example of "5 hours - 5 days per week" as an average, can be more than enough. Personally I wouldn't want to exceed something around that, because of quality of life and other activities outside screens. I know that you (or your algo, better if supervised) need to be there when the opportunity arises in order to make the trades.

---

If it's daily on the whole account, well, very big aggregate returns indeed. I get your way of treating DD, as the open cost of doing business; so I suppose it can get as least as big as the daily winnings. Pretty great balance if you can control it well

---

Btw, about posts #1082 and #1084... then what, are some "lines/historic levels" useful or not?
Quoting Viktor
{quote} I understand the reason. I question it as an hypothetical, to have a better frame of reference for comparison to other markets
Sometimes there are no trades whole day or even 2 days in a row. We are sitting in my discord trading room with 3 amigos and chat all day doing nothing. Or switch to forex. Because there are no volume on the market. Trading is like hunting or fishing. It is not possible to kill 1 elephant every day 5 days a week. Sometimes there are no elephants. Or they are far away. Or you shot and missed...


Quoting Viktor
Btw, about posts #1082 and #1084... then what, are some "lines/historic levels" useful or not?
Totally useless. You can use "high" or "low" with some context, like volume/delta or with calculations of stop levels depending on the imbalance. But just drawing lines and think they are supp/res - this is garbage.
Observer effect
Let me add more how to fish in this swamp

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1. Check the dashboard. What you see here?

We have BTC with volume about 2m$/per minute. This is nothing. Also we have ETH with less than 1m$/min.

Now let's check their distance, it is 0.115% and 0.159%.

Hmm, let's check forex GOLD.

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It is 0.04%, so 0.04% with 500x and 0.115% with 100x. Then 0.04% * 5 = 0.2%, so you better go and trade XAUUSD instead of BTC. Because in this example 0.115% and 0.2% - you know what to choose. For example Gold vol on CME is about 200 lots in average, so it is 20m$/per minute. Compare 20m and 2m.

2. Now go back to dashboard. There are no asset >200k$/min with distance >0.2%
That mean today is not a day to trade crypto. Let's wait.

Also, you can't you know trade BTC. You must look at the market in general. If it start to run it run. It is calm it all calm.
Observer effect
I have added psar indicator to the bot it worsk just great,
Now it is possible to trade with trend too also, not only against the trend, it filter out early entries with big success rate

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>20% today on etc with psar and delta + ma order and distance of course too
(psar just filtered out all shit and also I use it as trailing stop, so profits are not static with distance, but dynamic)


p.s. and Volume imbalance is the key of course. It will not works without volume data.
Observer effect
I have finished my volume dashboard. So now it looks that great:

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As you see now it is easy to check what to trade using volume filter, and everything sorted by distance.

Now I'm moving everything from SQLite to Redis, because Redis is in-memory database and it is extremely fast for the things live saving live datastream from exchanges.

Remember: trying to mix OCHL data is a way to nowhere. No matter what indicator you will use, no matter how many of them you will use and how you will mix their data without volume you are just a blind cat.

So use the power of knowledge in your trading. Stop dreaming and cheating yourself. It is impossible to win in this game using feelings and drawing tools. Only algos! Only hardcore!!!
Observer effect
About candles.

Each candle has open, close, high and low values. And there is nothing to do with volume or liquidity. There can be 3 trades: open, close and one very high. Then we will see long shadow (wick). But there were no volume at all. At the same time we can have huge volume too with same candle visualization.

Wick of candle can't say us if there IS liquidity or not. And it can't say if there WAS volume or not.

All you must understand that size of the candle, wick size, color - all mean NOTHING without context. It is just a visualization using some rules.


To answer the question about liquidity and volume you have to analyze orderbook at least. And even if you did you will have only 30% of the picture. Also you must calculate trades to determine where stops are located and of course you must check recent trades called volume.
Observer effect
Abnormal big volume found on ETCUSDT now:

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In average it is very low. Last weeks start to grow and was about 150-200k$ per minute. And look now - it is about 1million$ per minute


3 trades +13.87%

What else you need to trade? Only VOLUME!
Observer effect
Ryuryu,

I am receiving data (recent trades) via API from Bybit. And currently I am not connected to any broker.

Is this data (recent trades) all trades (all volume) that is being traded on all exchanges for this crypto coin?
Or can we only see the volume traded on this exchange (Bybit)? Or can we only see volume that is traded through our broker on this particular exchange (once we connect it)?

So: In order to have the real picture of the market, do I have to look what is happening on all the exchanges for my crypto coin in order to have full picture? So I have to sum all the buyers and all the sellers from every broker and every exchange in order to see what is really happening?
(Where can I see this volume?)

Thank you in advance.

P.S.: Bybit just replyed to me, that they only show volume traded via their exchange (volume from all the brokers that trade via their exchange).

Best regards
Quoting Mihajlou
Ryuryu, I am receiving data (recent trades) via API from Bybit. And currently I am not connected to any broker.
You are connected to broker named Bybit.

If you got data from bybit then you got bybit data yes. If you want to make "full picture" then you have to get data the same way from other exchanges. There are some big ones like FTX, Binance, Bitfinex and others.

But they key here that you don't need it. If you are trading on binance then you must have binance data. There is no need to see average "some" from all over the world.

We are using volume data to determine IF the volume is tradable. Who cares if it is tradable on binance if I'm trading on bybit?

For example on bybit now only LINK is tradable for me (since I'm trading shorts only)

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And I don't care what happening on Huobi exchange for example. What this information is for? I have no assets on Huobi. I have assets on bybit and my bots are trading on bybit.

Also. Imagine you have 100$. Then if volume of the asset is 100000$ per minute you can trade it. For example you have rules like that. Also you calculate average volume and then you have "oh, FTX vol is twice more then average". But "average" for FTX and this coin is only 5000$. See?

That's why you have to analyze data from the exchange you are trading at.
Observer effect
Quoting ryuryu
{quote} You are connected to broker named Bybit. If you got data from bybit then you got bybit data yes. If you want to make "full picture" then you have to get data the same way from other exchanges. There are some big ones like FTX, Binance, Bitfinex and others. But they key here that you don't need it. If you are trading on binance then you must have binance data. There is no need to see average "some" from all over the world. We are using volume data to determine IF the volume is tradable. Who cares if it is tradable on binance if I'm trading...

Thank you for the reply. That is logical, yes.

But, what about the influence that other volume has on price change? For example: What if today only small traders are trading XRP/USDT in Bybit, but there is Big player on Binance. I assume, that the influence (effect) he will have on the (general) market will be present also on the Bybit exchange, but the volume on the Bybit will not show me the real reason why this move happened... So my analysis of the market will be wrong/not accurate. Or am I not seeing/interpreting something correctly?
Or: How can I be sure that the "Big player" I see on Bybit will be "stronger/bigger" than the Big player on Binance? (How can I be sure which Big player I should follow?)

Do you know what I am trying to explain/ask?

Best regards.
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