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Prime of Prime Broker

  • #321
  • Apr 5, 2015 8:26am Apr 5, 2015 8:26am
I don't want to open a new thread so I'm going to ask a question here. Can somebody explain to me what is a benefit to use prime of prime broker instead of the normal / regular broker.
  • #322
  • Apr 5, 2015 1:55pm Apr 5, 2015 1:55pm
Quoting xoxo12
I don't want to open a new thread so I'm going to ask a question here. Can somebody explain to me what is a benefit to use prime of prime broker instead of the normal / regular broker.
Only if you trade with more than 100 lots/10million per clip. Why? Most retail brokers have a very high trade costs and most are mm in disguise of stp. Don't worry if you are going to make it in this business you will know these things.
  • #323
  • Apr 5, 2015 3:30pm Apr 5, 2015 3:30pm
Quoting Supertrader9
{quote} Only if you trade with more than 100 lots/10million per clip. Why? Most retail brokers have a very high trade costs and most are mm in disguise of stp. Don't worry if you are going to make it in this business you will know these things.
It's really just about the safety and that everything is transparent from PB to Tom/Next at a Prime of Prime, that you just know your liquidity is not dodgy and they can fuck around with spreads during NFP.

That's just why the more experienced people choose prime of prime and trade on currenex rather than FXCM because it's just different and there's always a few tips and tricks these non institutional brokers play.
  • #324
  • Apr 5, 2015 5:02pm Apr 5, 2015 5:02pm
thanks guys for an answer
  • #325
  • Apr 5, 2015 11:43pm Apr 5, 2015 11:43pm
Quoting plotinus82
{quote} It's really just about the safety and that everything is transparent from PB to Tom/Next at a Prime of Prime, that you just know your liquidity is not dodgy and they can fuck around with spreads during NFP. That's just why the more experienced people choose prime of prime and trade on currenex rather than FXCM because it's just different and there's always a few tips and tricks these non institutional brokers play.

Ctrader from a reputable brokerage, for example pepperstone is good for small retail traders. Plotinus in your experience what is the maximum liquidity you had ever seen in london session for EURUSD within 1pip?
  • #326
  • Apr 5, 2015 11:47pm Apr 5, 2015 11:47pm
Quoting xoxo12
thanks guys for an answer
You are welcome. Your best bet for a good transparent liquidity and execution is LMAX. Darwinex is good too.
  • #327
  • Apr 6, 2015 4:05pm Apr 6, 2015 4:05pm
I already read all posts in this threat 3 times. Lot of contradictory opinions regarding options. I were thinking in open an account in Baxter-FX but things didnt went well during trial and max. leverage is a little low. Regarding LMAX, lot of contradictory opinions - Last friday on NFP the spread were widen to 28 pips, its not the type of liquidity Im looking for. Last 2 weeks I saw some consistency on opinions about Tickmill and confirmed lowest spreads even during News releases, but they didnt accept me as customer (EU resident).

Its 1st time I see someone mention Darwinex/Pepperstone on this topic, around 32 pips spread on NFP is a little out of line with other retail brokers...

I have account on IB and IC Markets and looking for alternative accounts to trade FX.

What Im looking for is listening about execution difference experiences on Baxter-FX, FIXI vs. most competitive retail brokers. Some people say I will not notice the difference if Im making -100M/click. I trade max. 5M/click so no point in changing to PoP? (I trade a lot during Central Bankers speeches and News releases, looking for traders with execution experience in trading during that periods).
  • #328
  • Apr 6, 2015 11:46pm Apr 6, 2015 11:46pm
Quoting LostLucky
I already read all posts in this threat 3 times. Lot of contradictory opinions regarding options. I were thinking in open an account in Baxter-FX but things didnt went well during trial and max. leverage is a little low. Regarding LMAX, lot of contradictory opinions - Last friday on NFP the spread were widen to 28 pips, its not the type of liquidity Im looking for. Last 2 weeks I saw some consistency on opinions about Tickmill and confirmed lowest spreads even during News releases, but they didnt accept me as customer (EU resident). Its 1st time...
LMAX is essentially pure 100% ECN with no bank liquidity, so that's why liquidity can be poor. Correct me if I'm wrong.

IB and IC aren't considered as PoP.

If you're trading 5 mil per clip go change prime of prime.

5 Mil for retail is not small
  • #329
  • Apr 7, 2015 5:20am Apr 7, 2015 5:20am
They seem to have quite a few banks on their system.

http://www.lmax.com/popup-general-me...00&iframe=true
  • #330
  • Apr 7, 2015 6:28am Apr 7, 2015 6:28am
Quoting shrike
They seem to have quite a few banks on their system. http://www.lmax.com/popup-general-me...00&iframe=true
Not sure if they're LP or just use them for their ECN though.... That's what I heard.

It's odd that they have a buy side firm as liquidity...
  • #331
  • Apr 7, 2015 9:01am Apr 7, 2015 9:01am
Quoting plotinus82
{quote} LMAX is essentially pure 100% ECN with no bank liquidity, so that's why liquidity can be poor. Correct me if I'm wrong. IB and IC aren't considered as PoP. If you're trading 5 mil per clip go change prime of prime. 5 Mil for retail is not small
LMAX has bank members. http://www.lmax.com/popup-general-members-snapshot If they don't have bank members they could not have provided consistent liquidity around the clock. LMAX has no last look providence and as a result banks don't really like them. LMAX have firm execution and is very good for small retail traders.

If you look at pepperstone's ctrader market depth, you have 100 lots within 0.5pips consistently. So, 10million order is still small.
  • #332
  • Apr 7, 2015 9:05am Apr 7, 2015 9:05am
Quoting plotinus82
{quote} Not sure if they're LP or just use them for their ECN though.... That's what I heard. It's odd that they have a buy side firm as liquidity...
Optiver and gsa capital are non-bank liquidity provider.
  • #333
  • Apr 7, 2015 9:24am Apr 7, 2015 9:24am
Quoting LostLucky
I already read all posts in this threat 3 times. Lot of contradictory opinions regarding options. I were thinking in open an account in Baxter-FX but things didnt went well during trial and max. leverage is a little low. Regarding LMAX, lot of contradictory opinions - Last friday on NFP the spread were widen to 28 pips, its not the type of liquidity Im looking for. Last 2 weeks I saw some consistency on opinions about Tickmill and confirmed lowest spreads even during News releases, but they didnt accept me as customer (EU resident). Its 1st time...
Maybe you can try amifx.com
  • #334
  • Apr 7, 2015 9:34am Apr 7, 2015 9:34am
Quoting plotinus82
{quote} Not sure if they're LP or just use them for their ECN though.... That's what I heard. It's odd that they have a buy side firm as liquidity...
LMAX just set a pool where liquidity is supposed to be provided by external operators: retail, professionnal and institution. LMAX isn't a ECN broker.
  • #335
  • Apr 7, 2015 11:47am Apr 7, 2015 11:47am
Quoting Supertrader9
{quote} Maybe you can try amifx.com
It looks interesting, ty for suggestion.

Regarding LMAX I will give it a try also, is based in London Equinix LD4/5 so will going to setup a VPS in London and will try LMAX and IG Markets that have seen good comments also on this thread about their liquidity/execution.
  • #336
  • Apr 7, 2015 12:23pm Apr 7, 2015 12:23pm
Quoting LostLucky
{quote} It looks interesting, ty for suggestion. Regarding LMAX I will give it a try also, is based in London Equinix LD4/5 so will going to setup a VPS in London and will try LMAX and IG Markets that have seen good comments also on this thread about their liquidity/execution.
I wouldn't recommend lmax specifically for news trading. As far as i know they dont want it("toxic flow") and will ask you to stop. Their CEO said as much in interviews. Its a concession to LPs in order to get them to quote without last look. At least talk with them about it before, so you dont waste time. Maybe it has changed.
  • #337
  • Edited 7:13pm Apr 7, 2015 6:57pm | Edited 7:13pm
Quoting shrike
{quote} I wouldn't recommend lmax specifically for news trading. As far as i know they dont want it("toxic flow") and will ask you to stop. Their CEO said as much in interviews. Its a concession to LPs in order to get them to quote without last look. At least talk with them about it before, so you dont waste time. Maybe it has changed.
That really donīt amaze me but I were thinking LMAX trying to be kind of a real exchange. This is a industry controlled by bankers, they make billions/year the way things work. Most retail brokers are literally stealing $ from their clients. Maybe the only way is futures market the only really fair exchange, not sure about PoP because in essence i think it should work the same way because the LPs are the same as on most retail brokers products.

I worked in this industry as financial consultant 15 years ago, the world have advanced so much on technology and efficiency but looks like in FX it all remained exactly the same. Back then the brokers didnīt cover positions from clients with 5-10k accounts because they expect the clients bust the accounts sooner or later...
  • #338
  • Apr 8, 2015 2:20pm Apr 8, 2015 2:20pm
Quoting LostLucky
{quote} That really dont amaze me but I were thinking LMAX trying to be kind of a real exchange. This is a industry controlled by bankers, they make billions/year the way things work. Most retail brokers are literally stealing $ from their clients. Maybe the only way is futures market the only really fair exchange, not sure about PoP because in essence i think it should work the same way because the LPs are the same as on most retail brokers products. I worked in this industry as financial consultant 15 years ago, the world have advanced so much...

They are a real exchange with traders and bank and non banks combined but during news, only a minority trades.
  • #339
  • Apr 8, 2015 4:28pm Apr 8, 2015 4:28pm
Quoting shrike
{quote} I wouldn't recommend lmax specifically for news trading. As far as i know they dont want it("toxic flow") and will ask you to stop. Their CEO said as much in interviews. Its a concession to LPs in order to get them to quote without last look. At least talk with them about it before, so you dont waste time. Maybe it has changed.
Not many traders trade during news anyway. I tried trading news a few times, the result is really mixed so I would imagine it would be similar to other traders as well unless you have inside information. But to forbid it outright is not fair. So what, when they trade it and win it's fine and when we trade it and win against them it's "toxic flow"? What happened to "taking it like a man", something they always say to us whenever we lost because of them screwing us over? And we don't even manipulate the price and do those dirty last looks and requotes on them, and they can't take it when we win?

I knew it. Bunch of castrated sissy cowards calling themselves "prime banks" "liquidity providers", my a**!! WHERE were they during the SNB announcement?
Make your losses in demo. Earn your profits live.
  • #340
  • Apr 8, 2015 4:29pm Apr 8, 2015 4:29pm
Quoting Supertrader9
{quote} They are a real exchange with traders and bank and non banks combined but during news, only a minority trades.
LMAX is fine, one of the few real ECN brokers left.
Make your losses in demo. Earn your profits live.
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