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  • #37,221
  • May 31, 2024 3:44pm May 31, 2024 3:44pm
Quoting Cryptosurf
{quote} You should already know the answer since you have "mastered everything." {quote}
come on, I thought we moved beyond that, and I no longer critique anything you say for two months.
  • #37,222
  • May 31, 2024 3:46pm May 31, 2024 3:46pm
we have different opinions on what "mastery" means and I'm not gonna argue anymore, just trying to be friendly from now on to everyone.
  • #37,223
  • Edited 4:57pm May 31, 2024 3:58pm | Edited 4:57pm
Quoting Markula
we have different opinions on what "mastery" means and I'm not gonna argue anymore, just trying to be friendly from now on to everyone.
Ok fine, im good if you're good.

To answer your question, yes you can make 200k if you’re a decent (and more importantly,) disciplined trader. Get the largest account and start smashing it. Should be able to get there within 6-12 months without breaking a sweat.

Personally I would get to about 25K with a funded firm then open up a personal futures account. That would expedite the process
Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #37,224
  • May 31, 2024 4:05pm May 31, 2024 4:05pm
thanks a lot.
  • #37,225
  • May 31, 2024 5:08pm May 31, 2024 5:08pm
Quoting Markula
thanks a lot.
As an example, just trading after the open session between 10am to 4pm est today, NQ range gave away about 10k with just 1 mini contract.
Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #37,226
  • May 31, 2024 5:10pm May 31, 2024 5:10pm
Quoting hayseed
{quote} //----- tried your yodelling trick today...... it's a hard tune to follow..... 5 of the 20 didn't......h
as i said with intra trailing 15k is huge target. If it would have been end of day then it would have been piece of cake
Extreme gut feeling trader
  • #37,227
  • May 31, 2024 6:25pm May 31, 2024 6:25pm
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} The interesting thing there is that the super scammer Apex has 4.7 rating against the 4.6 of the super legit Top Step. {image} {image}
At this rate, Apex will quickly fall below Topstep. This for a very simple reason: Apex combines subjective rules, interpretations, and potential justifications. Exactly what every trader hates. Whereas at Topstep, everything is perfectly clear: very few rules, everything is square and precise. No interpretation. Topstep has been there for over 10 years, they suffered from competition from CFDs but they held on. And they will stay the leaders.
  • #37,228
  • May 31, 2024 7:00pm May 31, 2024 7:00pm
Quoting montygoldy
ANother thing to add after reading some of the recent 1 star reviews. They all seem to be accepting they broke the rule and crying for denied payout. I want to see if you follow rules and then denied
-Yes. Looking through those bad reviews, it seems that most are either:

1. Not stating any specific reasoning, and are just speculative in nature.
or...
2. Clearly a result of not following the rules.

There are some poor service/support-related reviews, but that is to be expected. I have personally experienced excellent support from Apex, for the most part. There are areas where Apex could improve on, just like any company, but when scoring the important things, their scores are favorable. Some people hang onto the small things; to each their own.

Anyone that has been around since the beginning of remote FX prop, and has witnessed, first-hand, the cancerous growth of cheaters, understands just how crucial it is for these firms to protect against bad actors. We also saw just how many newbie traders were entering this space, that had no understanding of what they were doing and seemed to refuse to educate themselves about the rules and would complain when they were negatively affected as a result. The same thing is happening with Apex.

We already know that payout denials will happen. We also know that it is advantageous, for the firm and for the majority of honest traders, for Apex to enforce their rules when it is appropriate to do so. We also know how salty failed traders can be, and will stop at nothing to blame everyone but themselves for their failures.

Yet, there are some here that seem to believe that even a single payout denial or bad review must mean that Apex are either scamming or becoming insolvent. They refuse to accept any possibility of legitimate denials while also hanging on to random posts that provide no actual evidence of wrongdoing. The overwhelming majority of reviews and comments about Apex are positive, yet that is totally ignored. Who is delusional here?

I think, it is better to exhibit some objectivity on this matter. As an example, referring to Apex discounts as 'panic discounts' just seems silly, considering the fact that they have been offering such discounts since the beginning.

We saw, already, how firms like MFF grew in popularity, which resulted in more cheaters, more violations and more newbie-trader-mistakes etc.. As a result of this, more efforts were made to combat the cheaters, more payout denials/bans were happening and more salty traders were plaguing their discord with partial truths.

It seems to me that Apex is growing and is making adjustments to deal with that growth. They are far from insolvent, in my opinion. Apex has very viable ways to remedy and mitigate insolvency without resorting to unethical practices. This obvious point seems to be ignored here.
  • #37,229
  • Edited 7:19pm May 31, 2024 7:07pm | Edited 7:19pm
Quoting Nehemah
At this rate, Apex will quickly fall below Topstep. This for a very simple reason: Apex combines subjective rules, interpretations, and potential justifications. Exactly what every trader hates. Whereas at Topstep, everything is perfectly clear: very few rules, everything is square and precise. No interpretation.
-It does not matter so much what the rules state, so long as they are reasonable. What matters more is how, if and when the rules are enforced. The truth is, every firm has CYA terms and an opt-out clause of some kind, so regardless of what the rules say, they can terminate services to you for any reason. If any firm starts to abuse their rules, it will become quickly known. We already know this.

The rules that Apex currently have are reasonable, in my opinion.
  • #37,230
  • Edited 10:14pm May 31, 2024 8:40pm | Edited 10:14pm
Quoting Nsak3y
{quote}-Yes. Looking through those bad reviews, it seems that most are either: 1. Not stating any specific reasoning, and are just speculative in nature. or... 2. Clearly a result of not following the rules. There are some poor service/support-related reviews, but that is to be expected. I have personally experienced excellent support from Apex, for the most part. There are areas where Apex could improve on, just like any company, but when scoring the important things, their scores are favorable. Some people hang onto the small things; to each their...
you summed up really well… as it is said nobody is here an affiliate or trying to defend apex. Its just being objective of the situation.
also any prop firm trader already know and experienced no matter how big is the firm it can go out of business like that. So better is to milk as much as possible and diversify with as many firms as possible.

NEW MONTH STARTING SO I HAVE WRITTEN DOWN SOME GOALS FOR THIS MONTH.
1. Get atleast 1 payout either from apex or topstep as they are the only funded accounts i have.
2. Get max funding from topstep. Already have 3x150k. Will purchase 2x150k challenges next week.
3. Also take evals from 3x150k myfundedfuturs and 3x150k take profit trader(confirmed with their chat they dont allow canadians for pro+ accounts but you can stay as long as possible on pro account. Like their daily payout stuff).

Stretch goal will be 11x50k bulenox evals.

Aim is to build portfolio.

MAY performance was worst month in terms of prop trading. Lost alot of funded accounts.
Extreme gut feeling trader
  • #37,231
  • May 31, 2024 9:13pm May 31, 2024 9:13pm
Quoting Cryptosurf
{quote} As an example, just trading after the open session between 10am to 4pm est today, NQ range gave away about 10k with just 1 mini contract.
Yes, I bought S&P off it's low at 1:00, just kept sliding the stop behind it. It pared it's losses and beyond, as did NAS. I was long DOW from the open, triggered a limit order right after open with an 80 point down spike. Very easy day.
Another point I'd like to make, though, where I am not happy with APEX.........can't be long/short in what are "assumed" correlated instruments. Yes, 90% of the time the indices move in tandem. However, 1st half today, DOW was rocking and NAS and S&P were well below their ADRs. It would be a violation if you actually traded these correctly today.
On DCA, perhaps, they should implement a max overall position size. As I stated earlier, I trade micros, if I average in 10 micros, all while in loss, I am less of a risk than the guy holding 1 mini from the original price of my first micro......that trader is in far more DD. Just thinking out loud.
  • #37,232
  • May 31, 2024 9:17pm May 31, 2024 9:17pm
Quoting Nehemah
{quote} At this rate, Apex will quickly fall below Topstep. This for a very simple reason: Apex combines subjective rules, interpretations, and potential justifications. Exactly what every trader hates. Whereas at Topstep, everything is perfectly clear: very few rules, everything is square and precise. No interpretation. Topstep has been there for over 10 years, they suffered from competition from CFDs but they held on. And they will stay the leaders.
Yes, I will be adding some Topstep accounts. There max is now 5, correct? I like Take Profit Trader as well.
Not sure if you have seen the recent videos, but Apex is potentially changing some things.....daily payouts, 8 min trading days, 40% consistency.
https://support.atf.com/hc/en-us/art...ote-and-Survey
  • #37,233
  • May 31, 2024 10:34pm May 31, 2024 10:34pm
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Yes, I bought S&P off it's low at 1:00, just kept sliding the stop behind it. It pared it's losses and beyond, as did NAS. I was long DOW from the open, triggered a limit order right after open with an 80 point down spike. Very easy day. Another point I'd like to make, though, where I am not happy with APEX.........can't be long/short in what are "assumed" correlated instruments. Yes, 90% of the time the indices move in tandem. However, 1st half today, DOW was rocking and NAS and S&P were well below their ADRs. It would be a violation if...
That bugs me. Can't trade metals in opposing directions either, even when gold goes up and silver goes down for a day or more.
  • #37,234
  • May 31, 2024 10:55pm May 31, 2024 10:55pm
Quoting pipmaster77
recent videos, but Apex is potentially changing some things.....daily payouts, 8 min trading days, 40% consistency. https://support.atf.com/hc/en-us/art...ote-and-Survey
Quoting pipmaster77
On DCA, perhaps, they should implement a max overall position size.
-Thanks. I am watching through the videos now.

As someone that is used to trading crypto and FX/CFD's, I prefer to be able to break up my trades into smaller sizes. However, based on the video that I am watching now, it seems that DCA copy services are a really big problem for Apex. For that reason alone, I am more than happy to have this rule enforced.
  • #37,235
  • Edited 1:04pm Jun 1, 2024 2:05am | Edited 1:04pm
Have not been around here for several days... I see I missed a bunch of noise about Apex finally enforcing their own rules & our 2 resident trolls up to their normal circle jerk clown routine.

I mentioned weeks ago that the multiple traders with million dollar payouts in the same month on top of back to back entire month discounts was making me a bit nervous about Apex... something was going to change to shut those massive payouts down just like with FTMO >1 year ago.

I don't DCA, I don't bracket NY open or news, no windfall profits over here, always <30% consistency, always use stops and w/ positive R:R, never withdraw into 2.6K buffer, don't churn accounts... 20 50K PAs w/ highest number being #24 = I've had zero payout issues in last 9 months with Apex including this last 15-20th payout period.

However, I do 100% blame Apex for shelling out damn near 180M million without any semblance of a functional risk compliance department in place. They were letting a lot of shit slide by without enforcement which just emboldened the cheaters until they became a major costly problem for them. I wish I knew a lot earlier that the 30% rule was not being enforced lol.
  • #37,236
  • Jun 1, 2024 2:15am Jun 1, 2024 2:15am
These people are really shameless.
Their servers can't handle the load (if we accept that the problems are from overload), they are understaffed, but they are extending promotion. Again!
No rules on cheap evals just to get people on the hook. They want Consistency, but you can pass in 1 day.
250k accounts promo, which stats and estimations shows for sure, that the potential payouts are less than sale income.
They are making millions, but their site, processes and communication looks like shit.
In the same time they are playing victim and do not stop talk about scammers and schemes, just because can not make crystal and non-subjective rules.
  • #37,237
  • Jun 1, 2024 2:40am Jun 1, 2024 2:40am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Yes, I will be adding some Topstep accounts. There max is now 5, correct? I like Take Profit Trader as well. Not sure if you have seen the recent videos, but Apex is potentially changing some things.....daily payouts, 8 min trading days, 40% consistency. https://support.atf.com/hc/en-us/art...ote-and-Survey
Yes exactly, the max is now 5 (funded) but you can copy more than 10 challenge accounts in Topstepx and the new funded will be put in the queue.

Regarding Apex, I don't like them for 2 big reasons : first is the threshold in real time (not the case with Topstep) and the second the subjectivity of some new rules
  • #37,238
  • Edited 4:46am Jun 1, 2024 4:18am | Edited 4:46am
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Followed the path of our yolo king (without the yolo part of course) and started D Zero end of April and got to the first 30K in 5 weeks. Must say it is Expos fault and I am greatful for his tips. With all the cirkus going on in the prop space it is safe long term option and at least the real "win when we win" LOL. It is a good side project if nothing else, but my personal opinion is that it can develope into a main project in a year or a bit less. Depending what the market gives of course.

So far I must say I am impressed by how their risk engine works, they have done excellent job creating it and it is a must look and participation for anyone that wants to see how the prop should be run imho. A real one I mean.
Yes FTMO, MFF and 5ers have done excellent job covering up this virtual funds part for a while, until a bunch of kids entered the space and showed everybodys hands, because up until then we could only guess. Meanwhile the D was the real funds with investors and all that was promised at others and I really regret not participating then already as a side project, because I am not getting any younger.
PVSRA
  • #37,239
  • Jun 1, 2024 6:29am Jun 1, 2024 6:29am
Quoting Nehemah
{quote} At this rate, Apex will quickly fall below Topstep. This for a very simple reason: Apex combines subjective rules, interpretations, and potential justifications. Exactly what every trader hates. Whereas at Topstep, everything is perfectly clear: very few rules, everything is square and precise. No interpretation. Topstep has been there for over 10 years, they suffered from competition from CFDs but they held on. And they will stay the leaders.
You may be right but I see this from another angle.

Cheaters will be always here and they clearly attacked much more Apex than TopStep. If Apex is shoving them away they won't be quiet because there is too much easy money to be made. The next easy target is Topstep.

So my prediction is that very soon we will see TopStep having the same issues and/or making their rules more strict, just like apex.

Note: I'm not favoring one or the other and I agree that Apex let this much more than they should. Let's see if they woke up in time to control damages.
  • #37,240
  • Edited 1:54pm Jun 1, 2024 1:28pm | Edited 1:54pm
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} You may be right but I see this from another angle. Cheaters will be always here and they clearly attacked much more Apex than TopStep. If Apex is shoving them away they won't be quiet because there is too much easy money to be made. The next easy target is Topstep. So my prediction is that very soon we will see TopStep having the same issues and/or making their rules more strict, just like apex. Note: I'm not favoring one or the other and I agree that Apex let this much more than they should. Let's see if they woke up in time to control...
3 accounts max (at the time) + daily limit + scaling plan + 5 days of >$200 to get 50% payout & 30 days of >$200 days to get 100% payout made topstep way less attractive to the cheaters. That being said... DCA, NY open & news bracket trading, 100% risk of daily limit to make 50-100 are all allowed over @ TS & now completely banned @ Apex.

A lot of cheaters use scalping systems going for <20 ticks with massive SLs/use entire dd as sl which can dramatically increase accuracy >90%. They are losing systems that will eventually blow up with 1 loss, however you can get several weeks to months long winning streaks before you blow up which is perfect to take advantage of the prop model.... just rinse and repeat churning through accounts.
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