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  • #32,801
  • Mar 8, 2024 11:03am Mar 8, 2024 11:03am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Absolutely. You only need $200 per day...the key is the copy trading accross 20 accounts. Once you hit the $200, close apex, if your system triggers another setup..... trade another prop, personal, etc....
Absolutely will do this, thx PM
A snails pace wins the race :-)
  • #32,802
  • Mar 8, 2024 11:04am Mar 8, 2024 11:04am
Quoting Takisd
{quote} Karl, because of dishonest marketing do you issue an SRO and seize all assets? Coca cola would be gone by now if that was the case. "The leading futures trading platform". Also misleading, because there are many futures platforms that are not prop firms who this describes more accurately, but its still used to misrepresent companies in the futures prop space. You keep trying to be smart with your BOLD and underlined words, telling people who aren't americans how stupid they are because they dont use the right terms to describe legal actions...
and all of the covid "vaccine" companies should be shut down then as well, if we wish to talk about deceptive marketing.
  • #32,803
  • Mar 8, 2024 11:15am Mar 8, 2024 11:15am
Quoting Takisd
{quote} Karl, because of dishonest marketing do you issue an SRO and seize all assets? Coca cola would be gone by now if that was the case. "The leading futures trading platform". Also misleading, because there are many futures platforms that are not prop firms who this describes more accurately, but its still used to misrepresent companies in the futures prop space. You keep trying to be smart with your BOLD and underlined words, telling people who aren't americans how stupid they are because they dont use the right terms to describe legal actions...
Red bull gives you wings
  • #32,804
  • Mar 8, 2024 11:20am Mar 8, 2024 11:20am
In Apex, assuming that my funded already passed the 2600 threshold, what happens in this exaggerated example ?

Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: apexexample.PNG Size: 3 KB




Total payout is 2000

Is that coming +30% from a single day ? Theoretically yes (it's all from the last day)

However the 2000 is only 16.7% of the total 12000 profits

I wonder how Apex system reads this. I hope it's like 16.7%
  • #32,805
  • Mar 8, 2024 11:34am Mar 8, 2024 11:34am
Quoting Capablanca
In Apex, assuming that my funded already passed the 2600 threshold, what happens in this exaggerated example ? {image} Total payout is 2000 Is that coming +30% from a single day ? Theoretically yes (it's all from the last day) However the 2000 is only 16.7% of the total 12000 profits I wonder how Apex system reads this. I hope it's like 16.7%
Post it in the discord chat and see.
Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #32,806
  • Mar 8, 2024 11:51am Mar 8, 2024 11:51am
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} Red bull gives you wings
even viagra has misleading marketing. The fine print literally says death can be a side effect. But the advertisement said I would be a youthful geriatric with a boner that won't quit.
  • #32,807
  • Mar 8, 2024 11:53am Mar 8, 2024 11:53am
Quoting Takisd
lying under oath isn’t a small fry thing. Infront of the judge whilst sworn in.
-It's not, but I have to wonder if it will carry any weight in the case, especially since things are likely to resolve through settlement. I cannot imagine that the CFTC will walk away from this without ensuring that the remote prop business is done going forward.
  • #32,808
  • Mar 8, 2024 11:57am Mar 8, 2024 11:57am
Quoting Nsak3y
{quote}-It's not, but I have to wonder if it will carry any weight in the case, especially since things are likely to resolve through settlement. I cannot imagine that the CFTC will walk away from this without ensuring that the remote prop business is done going forward.
It would require a ruling. So the question will be - Will CFTC let it reach a ruling? If there is a time to settle it is now because if more "comes out" then trial will be burdensome for the CFTC.
  • #32,809
  • Mar 8, 2024 12:06pm Mar 8, 2024 12:06pm
Quoting Takisd
{quote} It would require a ruling. So the question will be - Will CFTC let it reach a ruling? If there is a time to settle it is now because if more "comes out" then trial will be burdensome for the CFTC.
The leadership of the CFTC might also be completely gutted with the SEC DOJ & FTC by the time a long trial is completed.
  • #32,810
  • Mar 8, 2024 12:10pm Mar 8, 2024 12:10pm
Quoting CableJ
{quote} The leadership of the CFTC might also be completely gutted with the SEC DOJ & FTC by the time a long trial is completed.
Yes the election year part comes into play as well.
  • #32,811
  • Edited 12:30pm Mar 8, 2024 12:18pm | Edited 12:30pm
Quoting KarlKraus
{quote} Here we go again. There’s no such thing as a “guilty verdict” in a civil case. Honestly the level of understanding of what’s happening here is about zero. {quote} And the allegation that MFF's "We win when you win" claim was dishonest - was that "proven false" or was it actually true? Honestly the level of understanding of what’s happening here is about zero.
You know what happens to US brokers the CFTC found guilty of deceptive marketing and anti consumer behavior... FINES!

Quoting KarlKraus
{quote} Apart from all the generations of future customers, the protection of whom is the CFTC’s primary public policy duty, you mean? Honestly the level of understanding of what’s happening here is about zero.
The CFTC didn't protect me when CFTC regulated Refco went down with 34K of my money in non segregated accounts.
  • #32,812
  • Mar 8, 2024 12:25pm Mar 8, 2024 12:25pm
Quoting Takisd
It would require a ruling. So the question will be - Will CFTC let it reach a ruling? If there is a time to settle it is now because if more "comes out" then trial will be burdensome for the CFTC.
-There is no way that the CFTC will not settle this. Sadly, I do not think that their mistakes will hinder them in their efforts to see their desired outcome come to fruition, either.

Ultimately, even if Kamzi's legal council advises that they might actually have a case here, if there is any chance that Kamzi could face jail time or lose everything etc., then he may elect to settle, even if he knows that he's not technically in the wrong.
  • #32,813
  • Mar 8, 2024 12:27pm Mar 8, 2024 12:27pm
Quoting CableJ
{quote} You what happens to US brokers the CFTC found guilty of deceptive marketing and anti consumer behavior... FINES! {quote} The CFTC didn't protect me when CFTC regulated Refco went down with 34K of my money in non segregated accounts.
Agreed, plus people can recoup loses for smaller individual claims but when it comes to large cases, rarely if ever are victims ever made whole.
Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #32,814
  • Mar 8, 2024 12:31pm Mar 8, 2024 12:31pm
Quoting Nsak3y
{quote}-There is no way that the CFTC will not settle this. Sadly, I do not think that their mistakes will hinder them in their efforts to see their desired outcome come to fruition, either. Ultimately, even if Kamzi's legal council advises that they might actually have a case here, if there is any chance that Kamzi could face jail time or lose everything etc., then he may elect to settle, even if he knows that he's not technically in the wrong.
its a civil case, as lord Karl pointed out. No jail time is on the table. Its just monetary.

The one thing that people may have skipped over (or not been exposed to) is that the jurisdiction argument is now back on the table.
  • #32,815
  • Mar 8, 2024 12:46pm Mar 8, 2024 12:46pm
Quoting Takisd
its a civil case, as lord Karl pointed out. No jail time is on the table. Its just monetary.
-If the conduct under investigation involves violations of criminal statutes or regulations, then it's possible that criminal charges can be brought by law enforcement authorities. As some members here seem to claim that MFF has committed consumer fraud, then it should go without saying that if that can be proven (or even be in question), then the CFTC may use that to encourage Kamzi to settle.

Contrary to what Karl may think about himself, he does not know everything.
  • #32,816
  • Mar 8, 2024 1:04pm Mar 8, 2024 1:04pm
Quoting Nsak3y
{quote}-If the conduct under investigation involves violations of criminal statutes or regulations, then it's possible that criminal charges can be brought by law enforcement authorities. As some members here seem to claim that MFF has committed consumer fraud, then it should go without saying that if that can be proven (or even be in question), then the CFTC may use that to encourage Kamzi to settle. Contrary to what Karl may think about himself, he does not know everything.
The vast majority was not committed inside the jurisdiction of the CFTC, you are correct in your thought but it won't become a criminal case. The threshold of proof is significantly higher and even at civil level its flimsy.

I agree with Karl, it will settle. But given the situation now who knows what the settlement will look like. I highly doubt it will come with fraud. If you agree to fraud you basically are asking never to be able to bank again or operate a business again. No sane human will accept that.
  • #32,817
  • Mar 8, 2024 1:13pm Mar 8, 2024 1:13pm
Quoting Takisd
The vast majority was not committed inside the jurisdiction of the CFTC, you are correct in your thought but it won't become a criminal case. The threshold of proof is significantly higher and even at civil level its flimsy. I agree with Karl, it will settle. But given the situation now who knows what the settlement will look like. I highly doubt it will come with fraud. If you agree to fraud you basically are asking never to be able to bank again or operate a business again. No sane human will accept that.
-I'm not saying that there will be a criminal case. As mentioned, I also think that a settlement will be reached. The point that I was trying to make, is that, if there is even a small chance that criminal charges could eventually be brought against Kamzi, then he may decide to settle even if he knows that he's not in the wrong (or at least that it's legally unclear) with the CFTC stuff.
  • #32,818
  • Mar 8, 2024 1:47pm Mar 8, 2024 1:47pm
Quoting CableJ
You know what happens to US brokers the CFTC found guilty of deceptive marketing and anti consumer behavior... FINES!

Only the ones they regulate. They have no jurisdiction to fine businesses like MFF that they don’t regulate! What is wrong with you?

Honestly the level of understanding of what’s happening here is about ZERO.
  • #32,819
  • Mar 8, 2024 1:56pm Mar 8, 2024 1:56pm
Quoting KarlKraus
Only the ones they regulate. They have no jurisdiction to fine businesses like MFF that they don’t regulate!
-Um. What?
  • #32,820
  • Mar 8, 2024 1:59pm Mar 8, 2024 1:59pm
Quoting Nsak3y
{quote}-Um. What?
You focus on the bold and remove the first word. "What is wrong with you? ZERO".

Have a great evening.
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