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  • #25,581
  • Nov 6, 2023 3:43am Nov 6, 2023 3:43am
Quoting Capablanca
Thanks for the help with Apex guys ! {quote} EDIT: This problem is already solved, no need to answer. If someone has the same issue you can see the solution some posts below. I'm in Rithmic and I'm stuck here. I selected my account (it's just one 50K eval for now). When searching ES.CME or MES.CME I should get something, right ? Nothing shows up. {image} When I double click in the symbol field another window is opened but no symbols available. There should be a list of symbols there, I think. {image} The same happens in chart window. But everything...
I had same issue. Try to insert ES or MES in empty field on symbol search field. Than you should get list of symbols to choose. I member i couldn't get any symbols on chart for a while, but i could trade, just charts didn't work. Now I see charts. Even support couldn't solve it.
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  • #25,582
  • Nov 6, 2023 4:13am Nov 6, 2023 4:13am
Is it true in Italy what I heard, that when you have no money and no work you cannot survive anymore because there is no support from government anymore ?
This makes a lot of pressure. Because once you loose it all in trading you cannot live anymore too. So bad what Meloni is doing or...? She gets tax money for her job.
  • #25,583
  • Nov 6, 2023 4:25am Nov 6, 2023 4:25am
Citizens' money abolished: When the subsistence level is taken away

The Italian government under the leadership of Giorgia Meloni abolished citizens' benefits for the unemployed. Months ago, the coalition of right-wing and ultra-right parties announced that they would abolish the “Reddito di cittadinanza” (citizens’ money). The ultra-right Meloni says: “A fair state cannot put those who can work on the same level as those who cannot.”
Hardly any money to live on
Table of contents

  1. Hardly any money to live on
  2. “Inclusion assistance” instead of citizens’ money for job seekers
  3. Unemployed people are labeled lazy
  4. Citizens' money against poverty
  5. Dropped from all networks
  6. Skilled labor shortage and brain drain
  7. Stepping down instead of modernizing

Noodles are currently on offer. Lorenzo Barone rushes to take advantage of the offer. “I buy pasta because it’s cheap and fills my children up,” he says. He and his family have to live on a total of 780 euros a month. But that will soon be over. Even the little subsistence level is now to be abolished. Lorenzo doesn't yet know what will happen next.
“Inclusion assistance” instead of citizens’ money for job seekers

Only households with people over 60 years of age or with disabilities and with underage children should receive “integration assistance” of up to 500 euros per month from 2024.
Also read:
– Message via SMS – Meloni cuts citizen’s money to zero from August

All other unemployed people are considered “fit for work”. As of August 1, 2023, around hundreds of thousands of households in Italy will no longer receive citizen's benefit, which the INPS social authority previously informed them about via SMS.
Unemployed people are labeled lazy
The ultra-right uses “ability to work” to suggest that the unemployed only have no work because they are not looking for one. Youth unemployment in Italy was 22.3 percent in March 2023; only Spain and Greece are higher in Europe.
The reason for this unemployment among young people is simply the lack of qualified jobs and not, as the fascists claim, the lack of motivation to look for work.
Citizens' money against poverty
Citizens' money was introduced by the government made up of the Five Star Movement and Lega in 2019 in order to counteract the extreme and widespread poverty in Italy: a significant part of the population is not able to maintain the socio-economic subsistence level. Even with citizen's money, for many Italians in misery, illegal work in inhumane conditions was the only chance to survive.
Dropped from all networks
Young people who are neither employed nor in training or studying are called NEET in the EU. This means “Not in Education, Employment or Training”. Only in Romania are there more of them in the EU than in Italy. While the rate of such young people in the EU was 10.9 percent in 2022, it is 18.0 percent in Italy.
Skilled labor shortage and brain drain
While the fascist Meloni wants to force the unemployed to take any job (and in reality none) through de facto starvation, Italy is suffering from a shortage of skilled workers.
Between 2021 and 2022, around 80,000 Italians between the ages of 18 and 34 left their mother country to find skilled work elsewhere. The reason for this is often that they are overqualified and far ahead of Italian companies in digitalization.
Stepping down instead of modernizing
Robert D. Meyer wrote a year ago about Italy's ultra-right government: “The goal of the extreme right is not a strong welfare state. The ideology and method are based on stoking fears of decline, playing precarious people off against each other, and stepping down socially.” And this goal is now being implemented.

  • #25,584
  • Nov 6, 2023 4:27am Nov 6, 2023 4:27am
I mean if you did not need to pay any taxes until you are millionaire, so you can survive lifelong. That would be okay...but with paying around 50% taxes every year...??
  • #25,585
  • Nov 6, 2023 4:41am Nov 6, 2023 4:41am
Quoting TrAndy1
Citizens' money abolished: When the subsistence level is taken away The Italian government under the leadership of Giorgia Meloni abolished citizens' benefits for the unemployed. Months ago, the coalition of right-wing and ultra-right parties announced that they would abolish the “Reddito di cittadinanza” (citizens’ money). The ultra-right Meloni says: “A fair state cannot put those who can work on the same level as those who cannot.” Hardly any money to live on Table of contents Hardly...
That's what they voted for.
You will soon have the same in Germany.
  • #25,586
  • Nov 6, 2023 4:58am Nov 6, 2023 4:58am
Quoting TrAndy1
I mean if you did not need to pay any taxes until you are millionaire, so you can survive lifelong. That would be okay...but with paying around 50% taxes every year...??
Please focus on prop firm/prop trading in this thread.
  • #25,587
  • Nov 6, 2023 5:29am Nov 6, 2023 5:29am
Quoting TrAndy1
Is it true in Italy what I heard, that when you have no money and no work you cannot survive anymore because there is no support from government anymore ? This makes a lot of pressure. Because once you loose it all in trading you cannot live anymore too. So bad what Meloni is doing or...? She gets tax money for her job.
First of all almost in any worldwide country, they don't support you if you cannot afford anymore to live, especially if you was a trader and you didn't have a salary, traders are the less supported from the state, thinks that in Italy we pay 26% capital gain tax (before was 0% then 12% then 12.5% then 26) and we don't have any pension even if we pay millions in taxes.

For what I know, the best country that support you with rent, some money to live, support for your children, is Germany.

In italy this "income for citizen" up to 900-1000 EUR was a good thing but abused from people didn't have even right for it. Perhaps, should stop after you find a job, but jobs in Italy are so low paid, that was worth to get 600-800 eur per month that to work all the day for 1200, less fuel cost, less cost to buy a car, cost to bring children to a place while you work, you go at end of month in loss compared to this income.

So it's not a problem of Meloni, is a problem that was not well organised and they didn't have the correct tool in place.

Perhaps, this law was not good for other reasons. To get this help, you should have been 10 years resident in Italy in the past 10 years.
I was living abroad Italy for many years, so I didn't have right. Even if I had 4 children to support, and a really bad economic situation, nothing. So this is not fair, while other people was taking it, even with less of 10 years, cheating, or abusing, or looking for a hole in the law and some family was taking even thousands euro per month.

So a mess... hope they will take the time and make correction and however the law is still in place.

Quoting TrAndy1
I mean if you did not need to pay any taxes until you are millionaire, so you can survive lifelong. That would be okay...but with paying around 50% taxes every year...??
There are many countries, where you can live well in Europe and pay 0% tax. Like Cyprus for example (world wide trading not only financial but also real estate, Bulgaria also 0% for profit from EU exchanges, Gibraltar, also Neetherland you can get up to a max 1.75% taxation per year on trading and so on... till finish in UAE-Dubai but weather condition and lifestyle is completely different from EU.

Also in Italy there is a new tax for multi millionaires, or for has high income abroad and coming to live in Italy, where you pay a flat tax of 100.000 EUR per year. That's it, all the income is tax exempt. So let's say if Buffet or some rich manager of Google, or shareholder, move to Italy, they pay just 100.000 flat tax per year, even if they have an income of 100-200 millions per year or billions, flat tax.
in holiday till end of November
  • #25,588
  • Nov 6, 2023 5:43am Nov 6, 2023 5:43am
Quoting ladder
{quote} Please focus on prop firm/prop trading in this thread.
correct, we finished with politics, let's start the day.
in holiday till end of November
  • #25,589
  • Nov 6, 2023 5:48am Nov 6, 2023 5:48am
Quoting Capablanca
Hi guys, I bought a challenge of Apex to test them (Rithmic) but I'm a bit confused. They sent me a link for setup Rithmic/Ninja, which is in their faqs: https://support.apextraderfunding.co...ng-NinjaTrader I thought Rithmic is a trading platform (I'm almost sure that I tested Rithmic in the past in a demo) so what's the role here of Ninja ? Isn't Rithmic enough ?

Hi Capablanca, I chuckled when I saw your post. This is going to be me. Reading through Apex's faq, I am like "What's the difference between Rithmic and Tradovate and what is Ninjatrader? I need to connect to what?"
Maybe I should just buy a test account or 2 to test copy trader and see for myself.
  • #25,590
  • Nov 6, 2023 6:17am Nov 6, 2023 6:17am
Quoting Contessa22
{quote} Hi Capablanca, I chuckled when I saw your post. This is going to be me. Reading through Apex's faq, I am like "What's the difference between Rithmic and Tradovate and what is Ninjatrader? I need to connect to what?" Maybe I should just buy a test account or 2 to test copy trader and see for myself.
Are you the dax trader correct? which platform do you trade usually? just MT4 MT5? or do you have experience with other platforms?

the most simple one you should check in APEX or youtube, is the "tradovate", the web version is very simple to customise and copy trading is simple. Just to start, so you avoid to blow up accounts.

Otherwise in APEX website you can check other tools to copy with NinjaTrader, are add ons for 150$ if you need to trade some account with minis and some with micros, something that you can't do with tradovate that you can replicate in your groups the same contract you are trading in block, so only minis or only micros.

Also if you are going witj rithmic you have to have experience with one of the 10+ platforms they connect to, and have a license for it. Unique platform that is free is NinjaTrader 8, they give license for it and you will find in the APEX account your license.

So in few words:

1. Tradovate web, mac, windows, ios, android is free, tradingview also is free.
Tradovate group copy can be done only trading via the web-mac-win not via trading view or mobille
Also you get NinjaTrader 8 license for free and you can use that software, only on Windows or Parallels.

2. Rithmics: you get NinjaTrader for free to trade is a good tool.
For copy trading you should by add on that is compatible with rithmic, NinjaTrader or built in in the software (example Quantower)
Some software that use Rithmic could have a copy feature for free. But not sure which.
in holiday till end of November
  • #25,591
  • Nov 6, 2023 6:33am Nov 6, 2023 6:33am
Quoting forexbali
{quote} Are you the dax trader correct? which platform do you trade usually? just MT4 MT5? or do you have experience with other platforms? the most simple one you should check in APEX or youtube, is the "tradovate", the web version is very simple to customise and copy trading is simple. Just to start, so you avoid to blow up accounts.
Thank you so much for the tip. Yes I am the dax trader but I have decided to trade dow/nas/sp500 for futures prop.
I will just trade dax for my ftmo and 5ers accounts.
Also, I only used mt4, mt5, ctrader and broker's web-based platforms (IG, etc).
Anyway, I will test accounts using Tradovate so let's see.
  • #25,592
  • Nov 6, 2023 6:53am Nov 6, 2023 6:53am
Apex allows a lot of platforms, including jigsaw, which surprised me (sadly they don't allow multicharts)

If I understood correctly this page Tradovate can ONLY be used if trading on NinjaTrader, Tradovate Web or Mobile and TradingView

For those choosing rithmic there are plenty of platform choices.

I'm now testing all this Apex thing in Rithmic Pro, desktop version (alone - no Ninja), using micro contracts to avoid messing up. But so far it seems fine.

I think Rithmic also has a web version. I want to test that and see of it works (I have so many rubbish installed in my PC...)
  • #25,593
  • Nov 6, 2023 7:27am Nov 6, 2023 7:27am
Quoting montygoldy
Update guys on 3 x 200k phase 2 of accounts Day 6 since challenge purchased. 1. skilled funded trader- cleared 6% target now need to wait for 4 more days to get funded 2.Myflashfunding - currently gbpusd longs 201,164 3. Blueguardian - 193, 989$ all gold longs smoked today (from tomorrow i’ll recover it back from drawdown as max i have on account is 8% and the best part is target is only 4% so possible to achieve this by the end of the week) {image} {image} {image}
another update… another account passed.
1. Skilled - passed
2. mff - passed
3. Blue guardian - 3% negative


this week focus will be to pass blue guardian.
ultimate goal is to gain as much funding as possible from different firms. My personal goal is 3-4 million with 8-10 firms…
once blue gurdian done will purchase next batch of challenges ftmo 2x200, tff 400 and myfundedfx 200k together….
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Extreme gut feeling trader
  • #25,594
  • Nov 6, 2023 8:05am Nov 6, 2023 8:05am
If u withdraw to binance and like to speculate on binance futures you can use quantover for free thru api. I member one connection was free while ago and it was really helpful using quantover volume indicators.
  • #25,595
  • Nov 6, 2023 8:21am Nov 6, 2023 8:21am
for some reason i have come to like instant funding, not because i cant wait but i hate the fact that 8% and 5% profit of evaluation go wasted i maging doing evaluation of $ 1m with over 100k target so when you pass all that over 100k just go wasted after several months of trading.
MY OPINION NOT FINANCIAL ADVISE
  • #25,596
  • Nov 6, 2023 8:24am Nov 6, 2023 8:24am
I think Tradovate have 14 day trial with real time market data, so who want to check the platform can do it without buying an APEX account.
I am now sure if NinjaTrader demo is with live data.
Sierra Chart is the best and most professional platform, but with steep learning curve. And it is paid (for license and data). But if you plan a long career in trading I think that this is the way.
  • #25,597
  • Nov 6, 2023 8:26am Nov 6, 2023 8:26am
Quoting donfriday
for some reason i have some to like instant funding, not because i cant wait but i hate the fact that 8% and 5% profit of evaluation go wasted i maging doing evaluation of $ 1m with over 100k target so when you pass all that over 100k just go wasted after several months of trading.
It doesn't go to waste....once you pass, you have 20x max loss than you do on instant funding.
Instant funding....pay $500 for $500 max loss
Challenege, pay $500, pass, have $10K max loss
If you flip that $500 (stage 1) and then 50% (stage 2)....you will have $1,500.
This has been explained over and over and over and over and over and over, etc, etc, etc
  • #25,598
  • Edited 8:43am Nov 6, 2023 8:26am | Edited 8:43am
testing footprint charts today and delta grid on Tradovate, and my first trade with group accounts
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in holiday till end of November
  • #25,599
  • Nov 6, 2023 8:30am Nov 6, 2023 8:30am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} It doesn't go to waste....once you pass, you have 20x max loss than you do on instant funding. Instant funding....pay $500 for $500 max loss Challenege, pay $500, pass, have $10K max loss If you flip that $500 (stage 1) and then 50% (stage 2)....you will have $1,500. This has been explained over and over and over and over and over and over, etc, etc, etc

instant funding scale plan is good too
MY OPINION NOT FINANCIAL ADVISE
  • #25,600
  • Nov 6, 2023 8:37am Nov 6, 2023 8:37am
Quoting donfriday
{quote} instant funding scale plan is good too
nope...check it.....you flip the account. say 10% with 10% DD and they double your max loss....it is exactly the same.
Stop looking at the balance, it is irrelevant, MAX LOSS is the ONLY thing that matters.
Some companies don't even double you when you do the 10% with 10%, with those you are actually SCALING THEM, you are losing money.
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