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  • #14,001
  • Feb 16, 2023 3:10pm Feb 16, 2023 3:10pm
Quoting nomadtrading
Brokers offer funded Live accounts???
-Yes, but that was not the point.
  • #14,002
  • Feb 16, 2023 3:18pm Feb 16, 2023 3:18pm
Quoting Nsak3y
{quote}-Yes, but that was not the point.
Yes, really there are brokers that will give me 100k account Live fully funded for a fee like prop trading providers??? Which ones this is so new for me and probably all the traders here
  • #14,003
  • Feb 16, 2023 3:49pm Feb 16, 2023 3:49pm
Quoting nomadtrading
Yes, really there are brokers that will give me 100k account Live fully funded for a fee like prop trading providers??? Which ones this is so new for me and probably all the traders here
-It has been discussed here before. Most offerings are garbage and not worth the consideration due to very tight restrictions and requirements etc..
  • #14,004
  • Feb 16, 2023 5:14pm Feb 16, 2023 5:14pm
Quoting nomadtrading
{quote} Yes, really there are brokers that will give me 100k account Live fully funded for a fee like prop trading providers??? Which ones this is so new for me and probably all the traders here
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

here the best programs
in holiday till end of November
  • #14,005
  • Feb 17, 2023 12:55am Feb 17, 2023 12:55am
Quoting forexbali
{quote} https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing here the best programs
Thanks for the list. I see some of the direct funding missing
  • #14,006
  • Edited 5:11am Feb 17, 2023 2:13am | Edited 5:11am
Quoting nomadtrading
{quote} Instant, direct funding I said, Live accounts, not the demo challenges and their (MFF) accelerated program is the most expensive
My bad, sorry.
All instant are expensive because they are only giving you a DD = what you paid for (and the ones not expensive you should be suspicious because nobody gives someone 5K to burn in exchange for 1K).
Your best option, if you have access to it, is to open an account in a broker with high leverage of 1:500, like ICMarkets or so, and for 1K deposit you have access up to 500K (with the bonus of better spreads and execution). And you keep 100% of profits.
  • #14,007
  • Feb 17, 2023 9:04am Feb 17, 2023 9:04am
In case anyone needed a reason to be disgusted with fundednext.

Saw these gem campaigns using peoples suffering for profits..
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: screenshot.png Size: 293 KB
  • #14,008
  • Feb 17, 2023 9:20am Feb 17, 2023 9:20am
Hello,

have seen a few templates from major brokers with instantfunding new model 100k cost 6k DD 4k 106k DD stopt, 115k 6k back . ECN/STP No demo. new benchmark for me .
I also pay 8k for real account without this daily drawdown ECN/STP !!. And from 110k the drawdown stops and you can divide yourself how when what you trade. One of a couple different ones. Who now still deposits his own money with a broker !?? How rare Stupid or lazy in calculation must one be.... Under 100k you can not live on sure ! These retail brokers need to change or you are out of business. At the Summit this was said and it has murmured in the hall. They still advertised with their old model but only to save face to have time to brand the new contracts.
with your branding. This was a challenge to the leveraged investors and the other players in the market. This will change a lot in our favor and soon.
  • #14,009
  • Feb 17, 2023 9:26am Feb 17, 2023 9:26am
Quoting Takisd
In case anyone needed a reason to be disgusted with fundednext. Saw these gem campaigns using peoples suffering for profits.. {image}
That's disgusting, something so tasteless Pfui devil.
Immediately times deleted with me. Thanks for the info, something like that is enormously important! Thanks Takisd
  • #14,010
  • Feb 17, 2023 12:56pm Feb 17, 2023 12:56pm
I know the owner of a forex brokerage firm quite known in Europe.

I have an idea to propose prop programs directly via a broker.

Anyone can help me to define the perfect program that could be a win-win for both, the trader, and the prop firm?

I should cover all the aspect so if the profit of the prop firm should come from the fees, or from the profit sharing etc etc

Hard to make a business plan.. but I just post here if somebody have some idea
in holiday till end of November
  • #14,011
  • Feb 17, 2023 1:13pm Feb 17, 2023 1:13pm
Quoting forexbali
I know the owner of a forex brokerage firm quite known in Europe. I have an idea to propose prop programs directly via a broker. Anyone can help me to define the perfect program that could be a win-win for both, the trader, and the prop firm? I should cover all the aspect so if the profit of the prop firm should come from the fees, or from the profit sharing etc etc Hard to make a business plan.. but I just post here if somebody have some idea
I don't know what's a win for the prop but I have some clues of what's good from traders perspective

1. Slightly higher DD than target in phase 1 (like MFF with 8%/12%)
2. No minimum days and up to 90 days to complete phase 1 and same for phase 2
3. News allowed with lower leverage (for example 1:10) and news not allowed 2 minutes before and after with higher leverage
4. Good spreads and execution depending upon the lot size, trying to replicate real conditions
5. Payout starting at 80% with a decent increase up to 90% after a certain % of profit
6. Payout at any moment or at least weekly
7. Payout in a few hours without down time (allowing traders to go on trading)
8. Variety of payout methods, including crypto
9. Scaling capital increase of 25% for each 5% profit or something like that
10. Not issuing new credentials after payout (in order we keep the history)
11. Immediate credentials for phase 1 after payment and automatic credentials for phase 2
12. Secure KYC though external reputable company
13. Last but not the least, quick and good customer service and not guys that seem like brainless machines

I'm sure guys will come up with much more suggestions (and probably disagree with some).

Btw, Europe is probably the worse place to establish such operation, anyway.
  • #14,012
  • Feb 17, 2023 1:20pm Feb 17, 2023 1:20pm
Quoting Paloduro
{quote} ANY EXPERIENCE WITH takeprofittrader? ----------------------------- head
Can you belive that Takeprofittrader have a rule that fail your test if you make 50 % of the total profit in one day?
I m force to make doble the original profit targets of 9k now they are asking me to make over 18k profits to pass instead of the original 9k

I will abandon this firm.
i WILL FIND A BETTER FIRM AND I PREFER TO PAY A NEW FEE TO OTHER IRM INSTEAD OF KEEPING BEEN PUNISHED FFOR MAKING PROFITS .

======================================



You had 2 trading days, not counting today. Since for example:
The trading day of February 15 begins on February 14 at 6 pm EST and ends on February 15 at 5 pm EST. Everything in your dashboard is correct.

Regarding the consistency rule:
Your biggest trading day cannot be more than 50% of your total profit. Let's use 50K account as an example. The profit target is $3 000. You need to trade for at least 10 days in order to pass the test. This means that in the best case scenario, after 10 days of trading your account balance is at for example $53 100. Which means that you have reached the profit target and traded for 10 days. Now we are looking at your day to day performance. Let's say that on day 5 you made a $2 000 profit and that was your biggest day. $2 000 divided by $3100 = 64%, which means that your biggest trading day is more than 50 % of your profit. This means that you do not pass the consistency rule. However, in this case your account would not be liquidated, you would just need to increase your total profit, in this example to at least $4 001. Then your biggest day of $2000 would be less than 50% of your total profit of $4001 and you would pass the consistency rule.

I sincerely apologize for the fact that the previous agent did not answer your question about your new profit target.

Your biggest day was February 15, totaling $9,275.

Your profit target is $9,000, according to the consistency rule, your day should be no more than 50% of this amount, that is, no more than $4,500. You cannot decrease your previous day, but you can increase the profit target. You need to make sure that $9,275 is no more than 50% of the profit target.

This is done in this way: 9275+9275+1=18551. Your new profit target is $18,551. Your balance is now $160,980, you need it to become $168,551.

P
Fri, 13:35
ONLY AN IDIOT ASK FOR 2 YEARS EXPERIENCE TO TRADE ANY SYSTEM
  • #14,013
  • Feb 17, 2023 4:35pm Feb 17, 2023 4:35pm
Quoting Paloduro
{quote} Can you belive that Takeprofittrader have a rule that fail your test if you make 50 % of the total profit in one day? I m force to make doble the original profit targets of 9k now they are asking me to make over 18k profits to pass instead of the original 9k I will abandon this firm. i WILL FIND A BETTER FIRM AND I PREFER TO PAY A NEW FEE TO OTHER IRM INSTEAD OF KEEPING BEEN PUNISHED FFOR MAKING PROFITS . ====================================== You had 2 trading days, not counting today. Since for example: The trading day of February 15 begins...
Look like Topstep, they have too a rules in this kind. Generally, the problem is not the rules (this one is not so bad) but to know the existence of the (hidden) rules. Often, you have to pay to see.
  • #14,014
  • Feb 18, 2023 2:30am Feb 18, 2023 2:30am
I have no idea who these guys are (I would rule them out immediately because of trailing max loss) but I must say that this is not a hidden rule.

It's in their section of The 6 core rules

Rule 6. is Be consistent


A hidden rule is something that is not written in the site or in their T&C and/or a rule that is so much generic that can be arbitrarily used to deny funded accounts or payout.

Examples of these could be "you used too much risk", without specifying what is too much, "you have a trading style that is different from challenge phase", "we don't like your trading style" or something like TPT that would not pay 2.000 profits in account A because account B was -3.000.
These are hidden rules that we only realize after the fact.
  • #14,015
  • Edited 3:45am Feb 18, 2023 3:27am | Edited 3:45am
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} I don't know what's a win for the prop but I have some clues of what's good from traders perspective 1. Slightly higher DD than target in phase 1 (like MFF with 8%/12%) 2. No minimum days and up to 90 days to complete phase 1 and same for phase 2 3. News allowed with lower leverage (for example 1:10) and news not allowed 2 minutes before and after with higher leverage 4. Good spreads and execution depending upon the lot size, trying to replicate real conditions 5. Payout starting at 80% with a decent increase up to 90% after a certain %...
Capablanca check here if it is ok this "BEST" program:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

I agree with all what you said, I will keep max 12% max drawdown and decrease to 7% the daily, till I understand the business

Profit targets 7% + 4%

Days 40, no limits. Merge accounts: up to 3 of 300K, at any time.. no special rules.

Leverage 200 if trader has clean history and never got a daily loss, otherwise leverage back to 100 or 30 till make a new all time profit high

For commissions:

Options A commission based:
Forex/Metals: 2.5$ per lot, spread raw, no mark up on spreads, Fusion Markets / FP Markets / Ic Markets / EightCap like spreads are my best choice to compare
No special agreements for "slippage", so the same like to trader at your best broker.
Indices spreads commissions included: Nasdaq max 90/110, Dow max 110/130, Sp500 max 30/40
Oil: max 30

Option B zero commissions:
Indices like above, while forex/gold 2 point mark up (so spread 0 is 2 max). (I made a correction I wrote 1 for mistake)

Low spreads for all 28 main pairs, so good spread also for a GBPJPY, EURNZD, GBPNZD and similars and of course for the 7 majors.
I checked spreads of MFF and FTMO and a part EURUSD-USDJPY there is huge mark up on other pairs... finally paying 7.5 up to 10$ per lot... compared to brokers.

To get the best spreads possible I would router the liquidity like for indices to Ic Markets / Fusion style, forex to Fp Markets to keep spreads low on 28 majors/minors

Final execution will be guaranteed lower than MFF-FTMO-TFT (only TFT with eightcap could have on forex the same execution if they don't cheat on fills)

what do you think?

also I would need an idea of a software to manage the program, but this will come later.

KYC, payouts etc easy to handle..
in holiday till end of November
  • #14,016
  • Feb 18, 2023 5:07am Feb 18, 2023 5:07am
Quoting forexbali
{quote} Capablanca check here if it is ok this "BEST" program: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing I agree with all what you said, I will keep max 12% max drawdown and decrease to 7% the daily, till I understand the business Profit targets 7% + 4% Days 40, no limits. Merge accounts: up to 3 of 300K, at any time.. no special rules. Leverage 200 if trader has clean history and never got a daily loss, otherwise leverage back to 100 or 30 till make a new all time profit high...
Take a look at Finotive 1-step and instant funding. Their consistency rule is too strict but otherwise it's hard to beat those.
  • #14,017
  • Edited 5:56am Feb 18, 2023 5:30am | Edited 5:56am
Well it's a re-brand but I don't see any earthshaking changes! Still only 4% DDD allowed and they have changed broker

Inserted Video
  • #14,018
  • Feb 18, 2023 6:42am Feb 18, 2023 6:42am
Quoting Bizziebee
Well it's a re-brand but I don't see any earthshaking changes! Still only 4% DDD allowed and they have changed broker https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dt8ZntdeJ6w
I think the main change is not having the arbitrary risk analysis after phase 2. Many people complained about that. We need to wait to see if that's true.
And no minimum for payout (I think they had a minimum % of accumulated profit to do a payout).

Anyway, this and all the other changes are things pretty standard in the industry so they're not presenting anything new. They were the ones "wrong" when compared with competition. They just aligned now.
  • #14,019
  • Feb 18, 2023 6:43am Feb 18, 2023 6:43am
A comment: now they also allow to fulfill remaining days with 0.01 lot trades.

I know this also happen in other firms but it's a really retarded thing.

Instead of accepting that trader finished today, they're saying that he has to do 2 trades of 0.01 lots in the next 2 days. What additional information are they gathering with that ? Absolutely zero.
They are just hoping that people make a mistake or are stupid enough to go on trading.

If they were only interested in analyzing the trader they would never request that. This 0.01 lot rule is beyond stupidity.
  • #14,020
  • Edited 10:51am Feb 18, 2023 8:23am | Edited 10:51am
Quoting Capablanca
A comment: now they also allow to fulfill remaining days with 0.01 lot trades. I know this also happen in other firms but it's a really retarded thing. Instead of accepting that trader finished today, they're saying that he has to do 2 trades of 0.01 lots in the next 2 days. What additional information are they gathering with that ? Absolutely zero. They are just hoping that people make a mistake or are stupid enough to go on trading. If they were only interested in analyzing the trader they would never request that. This 0.01 lot rule is beyond...
Yep they are obviously trying to induce traders to go for broke whilst retaining the max 4% daily loss limit!

OK if you buy a 25k account, $1000 sounds a lot but when you can trade like 3 full lots on the offered leverage, it's very easy to rack up a $1000 drawdowm as we all know. And of course that carries on through to the funded account stage which is why so few traders are still in the game after a month or so

If you rather just take a $100 personal account and think if I lose more then $4 then I lose all my money - how long would it take to lose more then 4% especially if you are trading leverage 100:1 or more!

If you have the option pay to increase the DD limit to 10%, it does make a big difference although on the other hand, once you're down 2 or 3% on the account, it's awfully difficult to recover.
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