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  • #9,081
  • Jul 5, 2022 3:36pm Jul 5, 2022 3:36pm
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} Right. But at that time you will be trading your own profits but not receiving 100% payout. And it's tricky because if they give you a 3.000 initial drawdown and you make 1.000, then you can only lose 2.000 below the starting point. This is horrible.
Yes, sir. As I posted earlier, every company with rules such as these are simply to make you violate, just like the max lots rule they got you with at TPT. If they were necessary to mitigate risk or whatever they claim they are for, I'm sure the MFF and FTMO would have these rules as well. Perhaps they are there to mitigate risk in the early stages and as the firm grows they remove or modify them? I'm not sure, just see no reason to play when there are now several excellent options to choose from.
  • #9,082
  • Jul 5, 2022 3:50pm Jul 5, 2022 3:50pm
Quoting symmtrytradr
{quote} True, but it depends on reward:risk ratio on your trades and if the biggest challenge is the daily drawdown or max dd. I think most traders hit the daily dd but I could be wrong. If you take minimum 3:1 reward:risk ratio trades, your risking 333 to get 1,000. So you would have to lose 9 days in a row to hit the max dd, because trail is based on end of day profit. Still not as good as most firms with a fixed max dd based on starting balanced, but for some traders, they can make it work, especially with a goal of scaling to 2.5M. But I agree...
But remember, the 10% profit is based on the balance, but the risk must be based on the DD....so 10% profit with 10% DD is doubling the account, so of course, they SHOULD double you, you just flipped the account. You can do this on your own. There is absolutely no benefit there, you actually lose because you're giving up a % of profit. Once again, this is where the TrAndy sheets are priceless. Take the fee, apply what they are asking for profit vs. DD, if your fee compounds to a larger amount than the DD granted after passing, it is not a good deal. Period.

MFF...$979 fee, 24K DD, 8% with 12% DD (67%), than 5% with 12 %DD (41%). 979 in your own account* 1.67 * 1.41 is $2,305, MFF is 24K with 80% split is $19,200. $19,200 is much greater than $2,305.

If a firms fee is $1,000 and they want 10% with 10% DD and then 5% with 10% DD and then they are giving you $25K with 10% DD.....with a 100% split you'd be even anything less on the split.....you are losing money.
  • #9,083
  • Jul 5, 2022 4:16pm Jul 5, 2022 4:16pm
Quoting pipmaster77
But remember, the 10% profit is based on the balance, but the risk must be based on the DD....so 10% profit with 10% DD is doubling the account, so of course, they SHOULD double you, you just flipped the account. You can do this on your own. There is absolutely no benefit there
-Yes, and if it is similar to Ment, which it sounds like it could be, then the challenge fee costs a lot more and is NON-REFUNDABLE!

If like Ment, then they also likely have the same sneaky tactic of forcing traders to keep their own profits in the account to serve as the draw-down. This can even cause a trader to violate the account simply by withdrawing too much of their own profits.

If the aforementioned is true, then the score should be N/A (not even a consideration).
  • #9,084
  • Jul 5, 2022 4:35pm Jul 5, 2022 4:35pm
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The cuebanks marketing special.
  • #9,085
  • Edited 5:00pm Jul 5, 2022 4:36pm | Edited 5:00pm
NKOTB, a new prop firm anyone heard of ? The score is 3.4, not bad. Also they offer bi-weekly payouts, cTrader and free trial. https://www.smartproptrader.com/
Inserted Video

The title of video above says what they think, maybe thats the reason they want to be part of it ? Or only a marketing gag. Only 7 subscribers so far. Let's analyze them.
  • #9,086
  • Jul 5, 2022 4:44pm Jul 5, 2022 4:44pm
Quoting TrAndy1
NKOTB, a new prop firm anyone heard of ? The score is 3.4, not bad. Also they offer bi-weekly payouts, cTrader and free trial. https://www.smartproptrader.com/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vfV2pwRxGM The title of the video above says what they think, maybe thats the reason they want to be part of it ? Or it could only a marketing gag. Only 7 subscribers so far...
Hmmmm....sure looks like FTMO with no minimum days and more days on the stages. Swing account option, scaling is the same, 90% split after scaling.........
  • #9,087
  • Jul 5, 2022 4:46pm Jul 5, 2022 4:46pm
Quoting TrAndy1
NKOTB, a new prop firm anyone heard of ? The score is 3.4, not bad. Also they offer bi-weekly payouts, cTrader and free trial. https://www.smartproptrader.com/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vfV2pwRxGM The title of the video above says what they think, maybe thats the reason they want to be part of it ? Or it could only a marketing gag. Only 7 subscribers so far...

Don't you think that video is just filled with buzzwords? A kid gets on video with too much light and says things like "We took time to do this" "decades of experience in prop firms" whilst copying FTMO's site, "We care about longevity" but built an SEO table like TFT's to piggyback the competitors SEO (the comparison section). They added a few days extra to evaluations but I believe MFF showed us that most people fail before 30 days anyway. Its another evaluation that could be worth stocking up on more capital with, but it doesn't strike me as anything different.

Also, they clearly tried to bot one of their videos.
Inserted Video
1 like. but 11k views apparently.
  • #9,088
  • Jul 5, 2022 5:12pm Jul 5, 2022 5:12pm
re finotive.

Their server time is awful it messes up with the bars on longer time frames. Its currently 01:11 regular brokerage times (with rollover at5pm EST US) and theirs is 22:11 previous day. No new daily bar for another 2 hours :-s
  • #9,089
  • Jul 5, 2022 5:40pm Jul 5, 2022 5:40pm
Quoting TrAndy1
NKOTB, a new prop firm anyone heard of ? The score is 3.4, not bad. Also they offer bi-weekly payouts, cTrader and free trial. https://www.smartproptrader.com/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vfV2pwRxGM The title of video above says what they think, maybe thats the reason they want to be part of it ? Or only a marketing gag. Only 7 subscribers so far. Let's analyze them.
....when you click to sigh up it goes to the contact us page(with a button to contact them on discord).... and if you click on the "client area" it goes nowhere....
website does not function 100%...just a front page
Those who don't believe in magic will never find it
  • #9,090
  • Edited 10:46pm Jul 5, 2022 6:00pm | Edited 10:46pm
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} But remember, the 10% profit is based on the balance, but the risk must be based on the DD....so 10% profit with 10% DD is doubling the account, so of course, they SHOULD double you, you just flipped the account. You can do this on your own. There is absolutely no benefit there, you actually lose because you're giving up a % of profit. Once again, this is where the TrAndy sheets are priceless. Take the fee, apply what they are asking for profit vs. DD, if your fee compounds to a larger amount than the DD granted after passing, it is not...

That makes sense. MFF definately has the best offer but FT+ is only 1 stage, even though the initial dd is only 6% to reach 10% target. With the scaling, the first stage you start with 12k dd and it trails. However if you make 10% (double max dd amount) on the account balance without withdraw, the dd increases to 40k, and continues to double for next stages.

*edit* after running the numbers and looking at the fine print with FT+, it seems it doesn't make sense by the 4th stage (same with FTMO). FT+ requires you to use a portion of your withdrawal as your dd in the scaled account. So starting with 200k and reaching 10% your new max dd is 20k. They add this to the new scaled account to make it a total of 420k with the max dd of 20k. Your new target is 10% of the balance independent of the 20k, so a target of 40k. However, this 40k target doesn't include the 20k from the previous stage so in fact you have to reach 460k from a starting balance of 420k, i.e. you have to turn the 20k dd into 60k (3x the dd amount).

Like previously mentioned by pipmaster and TrAndy, you would be better off putting the money into a broker account and trading aggressively to 3x it over the same period. Thanks for the clarification.
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Plan your trade, trade your plan
  • #9,091
  • Jul 6, 2022 2:22am Jul 6, 2022 2:22am
Quoting Takisd
{quote} Don't you think that video is just filled with buzzwords? A kid gets on video with too much light and says things like "We took time to do this" "decades of experience in prop firms" whilst copying FTMO's site, "We care about longevity" but built an SEO table like TFT's to piggyback the competitors SEO (the comparison section). They added a few days extra to evaluations but I believe MFF showed us that most people fail before 30 days anyway. Its another evaluation that could be worth stocking up on more capital with, but it doesn't strike...
At the end of the page they make a comparison with other prop firms, exactly like TFT does in their website.
Btw, one of the companies used in the comparison is The Trading Capital. If they had done any research work in this topic they would know that The Trading Capital is a scam and not an ideal company to be compared with.
  • #9,092
  • Jul 6, 2022 3:10am Jul 6, 2022 3:10am
Quoting Expo33
{quote} Yes. TFF sent the money to my Deel account within 24 hours. {image} I try to stay humble but I think it's time to open up an Instagram account and show a pic of me with my new Lambo. Sexy and yet still humble {image}
good on you mate,
Hell yeah, time to shine
  • #9,093
  • Jul 6, 2022 3:19am Jul 6, 2022 3:19am
Woke up with covid and low vision. I blame the smartprop videos.
  • #9,094
  • Jul 6, 2022 3:46am Jul 6, 2022 3:46am
Quoting Takisd
Woke up with covid and low vision. I blame the smartprop videos.
I hope you're only kidding, but otherwise take care..
  • #9,095
  • Jul 6, 2022 3:51am Jul 6, 2022 3:51am
Quoting TrAndy1
NKOTB, a new prop firm anyone heard of ? The score is 3.4, not bad. Also they offer bi-weekly payouts, cTrader and free trial. https://www.smartproptrader.com/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vfV2pwRxGM The title of video above says what they think, maybe thats the reason they want to be part of it ? Or only a marketing gag. Only 7 subscribers so far. Let's analyze them.
The only thing they've got over MFF is the zero minimum trading days. They "fail" with price, DD and targets unfortunately..
  • #9,096
  • Jul 6, 2022 3:55am Jul 6, 2022 3:55am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Hmmmm....sure looks like FTMO with no minimum days and more days on the stages. Swing account option, scaling is the same, 90% split after scaling.........
Like you say, the ideal course would be maxing out the big two...then maybe TFF
  • #9,097
  • Jul 6, 2022 6:59am Jul 6, 2022 6:59am
Quoting symmtrytradr
{quote} That makes sense. MFF definately has the best offer but FT+ is only 1 stage, even though the initial dd is only 6% to reach 10% target. With the scaling, the first stage you start with 12k dd and it trails. However if you make 10% (double max dd amount) on the account balance without withdraw, the dd increases to 40k, and continues to double for next stages. *edit* after running the numbers and looking at the fine print with FT+, it seems it doesn't make sense by the 4th stage (same with FTMO). FT+ requires you to use a portion of your withdrawal...
Must also account for the fact with 2 of the 4 (FTMO and MFF), you will be taking profit splits along the way. While TCF and FT+ and of course the personal account, you are not withdrawing anything while compounding.
  • #9,098
  • Jul 6, 2022 2:08pm Jul 6, 2022 2:08pm
Quoting Nsak3y
{quote}-Yes, and if it is similar to Ment, which it sounds like it could be, then the challenge fee costs a lot more and is NON-REFUNDABLE! If like Ment, then they also likely have the same sneaky tactic of forcing traders to keep their own profits in the account to serve as the draw-down. This can even cause a trader to violate the account simply by withdrawing too much of their own profits. If the aforementioned is true, then the score should be N/A (not even a consideration).
Well said, another example below of trailing or relative drawdown on Surgetrader, it applies to both the challenge and the funded account.
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  • #9,099
  • Jul 6, 2022 11:37pm Jul 6, 2022 11:37pm
These "funding" firms are scams. FFS they are taking your money for you trading on a demo account which is free. The CONSISTENCY they want you to achieve BEFORE they pay you a cent is hard even for a pro trader let alone vulnerable newbies for which these things are marketed to. Stay away.
Please don't fall for them.
  • #9,100
  • Jul 7, 2022 2:38am Jul 7, 2022 2:38am
Quoting Cools81
These "funding" firms are scams. FFS they are taking your money for you trading on a demo account which is free. The CONSISTENCY they want you to achieve BEFORE they pay you a cent is hard even for a pro trader let alone vulnerable newbies for which these things are marketed to. Stay away. Please don't fall for them.

Not all of them ffirms have consistency rules mate. Thats why we are here discussing all of them.
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